Poorly V6

vitesse · 13th August 2018, 12:52

Daughter just bought 2001 spares or repair V6 tourer which has been unused in owner’s garage for 3 years, with half tank petrol. Pig to start but tow started and then drove home. Throttle body cleaned but still difficult start, despite v.good battery, almost like an automatic choke or FASD module SD1. Ran TOAF, can’t see any damage to lambda wiring (short to V batt), but both wheelarch inspection covers missing, cleaned area. Cooling fan does run on all speeds (now), got new VIS motors not fitted yet. But check engine sign illuminated. No power steering sensor.

Ideas please

KWIL · 13th August 2018, 13:03

Fuel? I know "old" petrol is a bit dodgy in some engines like lawn mowers, perhaps a problem with your V6?

Davethepaint · 13th August 2018, 13:13

Yes a purchased an Audi 80 years ago full tank of petrol would start on full (auto) choke but as soon a choke released just just died ran a separate supply ran fine. Petrol duff.

vitesse · 13th August 2018, 13:36

Thanks - thought about the petrol too but the lambdas reading short circuit is bothering me. Will add some fresh fuel and run Toaf again.

Regards

suzublu · 13th August 2018, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davethepaint

Yes a purchased an Audi 80 years ago full tank of petrol would start on full (auto) choke but as soon a choke released just just died ran a separate supply ran fine. Petrol duff.

Wow, an 80 year old Audi

Davethepaint · 13th August 2018, 14:08

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

SD1too · 13th August 2018, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by vitesse

... still difficult start, despite v.good battery, almost like an automatic choke or FASD module SD1.

Hi Mike,

The FASD on the SD1 is actually one of the most reliable systems you will ever come across. Mine is over 37 years old and still works perfectly, requiring no maintenance.
In recent weeks I got another non-starting SD1 going. The distributor was in a terrible state and the fuel pump was defective but the FASD was just fine.

The ‘automatic choke’ you also mention, the HIF44E electronic mixture control carburettors, is also a reliable design which performs as well as the best fuel
Injection systems.

The problem with both of these rests with the owners. When the car won’t start, they immediately point to the piece of technology which they understand the least: the cold start mechanism, and blame that.

Sorry.

Simon

vitesse · 14th August 2018, 10:19

Sorry too Simon as I don’t share your enthusiasm for the FASD module or water temperature activated chokes type Zenith/Stromberg. While perhaps able to cope with UK climate variation I found they couldn’t cope with Swedish winters. My first SD1, an S model had a manual choke which worked, my later VDP I drove with two batteries in winter as the starter got overworked - it then got the very popular manual choke conversion until I got my hands on an ex-Aussie flat top EFI system. Oh such joy, a car which started summer/winter with just one burst of the starter.

But anyway back to the present. A drained tank and fresh fuel hasn’t cured the 75’s starting problems and the check engine light is still on despite a good 30km run. Runs well, but on return home switched off engine and re-start was, to keep Simon happy, like starting a Saab V4 with automatic choke mid-Swedish winter.

Regards

vitesse · 18th August 2018, 14:13

Update: After changing the throttle housing, and lambdas to no avail, in desperation looked at the spark plugs. Despite a recent service, these were clearly dated and the gap 1.2 or more. Changed the front plugs and tried again - voom, immediate start and most fault codes disappeared along with the check engine light. Happy, went to bed leaving the rear plugs for today.

Replaced rear plugs, new VIS motors (tested by Dave x 2) and double checked with tester. All put together and the ungrateful car now reluctant to start and all fault codes returned along with check engine light.

At a loss esp with the VIS motors which I know work. Any ideas most welcome.

marinabrian · 18th August 2018, 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by vitesse

Update: After changing the throttle housing, and lambdas to no avail, in desperation looked at the spark plugs. Despite a recent service, these were clearly dated and the gap 1.2 or more. Changed the front plugs and tried again - voom, immediate start and most fault codes disappeared along with the check engine light. Happy, went to bed leaving the rear plugs for today.

Replaced rear plugs, new VIS motors (tested by Dave x 2) and double checked with tester. All put together and the ungrateful car now reluctant to start and all fault codes returned along with check engine light.

At a loss esp with the VIS motors which I know work. Any ideas most welcome.

Mike, you might wish to test that the supply from engine compartment fusebox fuse 1 is present, this comes out of the fusebox as a solid yellow wire, then connects as a yellow/blue cable into a splice joint in the engine harness

This is the supply for the HO2 sensors, and also VIS motors

The PAS sensor fault can be ignored.

I suspect that a problem with this circuit could be the issue here, and it's not uncommon for badly routed wiring to the lambda sensor to cause issues on the V6

As a last resort, you could always check the ECM/EWS on your car to eliminate the possibility of a defective ECM.

Brian

13th August 2018, 12:52	#1
vitesse I really should get out more....... Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Gävle Posts: 2,534 Thanks: 395 Thanked 823 Times in 652 Posts	Poorly V6 Daughter just bought 2001 spares or repair V6 tourer which has been unused in owner’s garage for 3 years, with half tank petrol. Pig to start but tow started and then drove home. Throttle body cleaned but still difficult start, despite v.good battery, almost like an automatic choke or FASD module SD1. Ran TOAF, can’t see any damage to lambda wiring (short to V batt), but both wheelarch inspection covers missing, cleaned area. Cooling fan does run on all speeds (now), got new VIS motors not fitted yet. But check engine sign illuminated. No power steering sensor. Ideas please Last edited by vitesse; 21st August 2018 at 14:53..

13th August 2018, 13:13	#3
Davethepaint Regular poster Rover 75 club cdt se Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Stockport Posts: 96 Thanks: 70 Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts	Poorly v6 Yes a purchased an Audi 80 years ago full tank of petrol would start on full (auto) choke but as soon a choke released just just died ran a separate supply ran fine. Petrol duff.

13th August 2018, 14:08	#6
Davethepaint Regular poster Rover 75 club cdt se Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Stockport Posts: 96 Thanks: 70 Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts	Poorly v6 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

18th August 2018, 14:13	#9
vitesse I really should get out more....... Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Gävle Posts: 2,534 Thanks: 395 Thanked 823 Times in 652 Posts	Update: After changing the throttle housing, and lambdas to no avail, in desperation looked at the spark plugs. Despite a recent service, these were clearly dated and the gap 1.2 or more. Changed the front plugs and tried again - voom, immediate start and most fault codes disappeared along with the check engine light. Happy, went to bed leaving the rear plugs for today. Replaced rear plugs, new VIS motors (tested by Dave x 2) and double checked with tester. All put together and the ungrateful car now reluctant to start and all fault codes returned along with check engine light. At a loss esp with the VIS motors which I know work. Any ideas most welcome. Last edited by vitesse; 18th August 2018 at 15:23.. Reason: Correction

13th August 2018, 13:03	#2
KWIL Precise Rover 75 Tourer 2.5KV6 Connoisseur SE Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Fleet Posts: 2,954 Thanks: 630 Thanked 617 Times in 480 Posts	Fuel? I know "old" petrol is a bit dodgy in some engines like lawn mowers, perhaps a problem with your V6?

13th August 2018, 13:36	#4
vitesse I really should get out more....... Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Gävle Posts: 2,534 Thanks: 395 Thanked 823 Times in 652 Posts	Thanks - thought about the petrol too but the lambdas reading short circuit is bothering me. Will add some fresh fuel and run Toaf again. Regards

14th August 2018, 10:19	#8
vitesse I really should get out more....... Rover 75 Saloon Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Gävle Posts: 2,534 Thanks: 395 Thanked 823 Times in 652 Posts	Sorry too Simon as I don’t share your enthusiasm for the FASD module or water temperature activated chokes type Zenith/Stromberg. While perhaps able to cope with UK climate variation I found they couldn’t cope with Swedish winters. My first SD1, an S model had a manual choke which worked, my later VDP I drove with two batteries in winter as the starter got overworked - it then got the very popular manual choke conversion until I got my hands on an ex-Aussie flat top EFI system. Oh such joy, a car which started summer/winter with just one burst of the starter. But anyway back to the present. A drained tank and fresh fuel hasn’t cured the 75’s starting problems and the check engine light is still on despite a good 30km run. Runs well, but on return home switched off engine and re-start was, to keep Simon happy, like starting a Saab V4 with automatic choke mid-Swedish winter. Regards