EU vote?

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by marinabrian

Carry over the analogy to the family being the United Kingdom, and I hope you see where I'm coming from.

There are always going to be disappointed people where a vote was a closely run as this one, but I firmly believe we are being presented with a once in a lifetime opportunity to make life better for everyone, it just may not seem that way to all at the moment

Brian

I have run out of Thanks, but thanks anyway - well said that man

[Best_of_British]

Originally Posted by bobthebuilder

But the current evidence clearly points to the contrary.

In addition, a banker has just been on telly reminding us that in all probability, the EU will add fees or tariffs to financial transactions going in/out of London. This may seem abstract to many people, but it will mean lower returns on our savings and pensions. Alternatively, the institutions will move out of the UK altogether, taking their enormous tax contributions with them.

Better listen to banker on TV then, bet he tells the truth.

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[Polly]

Originally Posted by bobthebuilder

44% of our trade is exports to the EU, 8% of EU trade is exports to the UK. They can take the hit. Plus, the money countries pay to join the EU can be considered the entry fee to the common market, there is no way the EU will let us trade for free whilst all the other EU countries have to pay.



Morgan Stanley moving 2000 jobs out of London abroad already.



Everything that 'Project Fear' predicted would happen is happening, and there are people who voted Out calling in to radio phones ins saying 'oh, I never realised that would happen'.

I think you have got your figures wrong. 44% of our EXPORT trade is to Europe, but that is only 6% of our overall trade, so even if we lost the lot, whilst it would be huge loss it wouldn't be the disaster portrayed. It is also worth noting that the 8% that Europe exports to us comes almost wholly from just Germany and France. Now you may be right, that they COULD just suffer the loss, but if they did, it would be a massive boost to OUR motor industry.
It's also important to remember that we have a huge NEGATIVE trading balance with Europe.


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[Polly]

Originally Posted by Nick Greg

Many who now are here unchecked be they criminals with serious or even murderous conviction in their homeland to the how many in the NHS with false worthless qualifications and other nasties who would never be allowed access. Many have been flushed out convicted and struck off as a trawl of even our pc-imbalanced news media will soon reveal. How mant remain to be flushed out? These include NHS immigrant employees killing patients.



The above was quoted earlier.



With the greatest respect I would substitute the word MANY with FEW. MOST of those who have come to the UK are hard working genuine people. Where I work we use temporary staff frequently in seasonal times. All are from Latvia/Lithuania etc etc. All of them are very hard working, are never lte and are ultra reliable. Its a pity that we are rarely offered indigenous UK employees - Why? Because they don't want to do the jobs on offer or are too lazy to do so. Many of those who have worked with us as temps are now permanent and they are a credit to the company. Our streets would go unswept, or loos un cleaned and many other menial tasks not done were it not for their work ethic.

I really can't agree with "the British workers are lazy" bit. Indeed that's a racist statement if ever I heard one.
That said though, EU workers do often do work that home workers won't do, but the reasons are not laziness, but more likely a work/ wages ratio that simply doesn't provide a decent standard of living. The foreign workers are often only here for a limited time, and therefore prepared to put up with long/ irregular hours, and living conditions we won't subject our dog to. Who in their right mind would want to have three or more jobs, just to scratch a meagre living.


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[Polly]

Originally Posted by bobthebuilder

I'm a very bad loser over this because people like my 15 year old daughter are going to suffer over this.



The thread started this morning was generally talking about the consequences of the Leave vote, which is why it's a real shame the threads were merged.

Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year


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[barney bear]

Originally Posted by Polly

Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year


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I'm a bit young to remember any of that but well said all the same

[bobthebuilder]

I'm not just worried about jobs and house prices (don't see what they have to do with the EU though TBH).

There are all the other benefits of EU membership I'm disappointed we might lose. Will a future government repeal legislation protecting workers rights? As I've posted many times before, who will prosecute big business to prevent restrictive practices (Microsoft etc). The EU might now be too weak to pursue the tax avoidance of Ebay and Google etc. People scoff but cleaner beaches, cheaper mobile phone charges, the regulation of cigarette advertising, compensation for late flights etc were all positive additions to our lives. Not to mention the right to retire or work in the EU.

[Darcydog]

Originally Posted by bobthebuilder

Not to mention the right to retire or work in the EU.

I do mention it because it was always one of my own and SWMBO's dreams - now because of the Brexit vote we may not be able to do this.

Please do not think I am trying to be all noblesse but I genuinely feel that the Country deserves better than :-

"The combined effect of having complex, all pervasive regulations and a draconian and unpredictable system of fines creates an atmosphere of perpetual legal jeopardy in a department like Defra. Every farming minister is condemned to hear the words "disallowance risk" every day of their working lives. No one really knows where they stand because it all depends on what a particular auditor on a given day might retrospectively decide. However hard we try to abide by the rules, it is inevitable that the British tax payer will be routinely stung by fines. This makes people risk averse and afraid to consider doing things differently or to try something new.

Of course, we can and do argue for reform of the system and will continue to do so but when you have 28 member states, each with completely different agricultural structures and each with totally different political make ups, coherence will never be a strong point of a Common Agricultural Policy."

The CAP for me exemplifies all that is wrong with the EU. I will happily give up my retirement dream so that the UK and the futures of all of us within it can be that much better by NOT having the stupidity of the CAP with its hindsight arbitrary fines.

And so far - yet again the scare stories put forward are being checked and found to be wanting.

It seems that Morgan Stanley never said they would relocate

It seems that the French have said that they will honour the bilateral agreement.

Originally Posted by Mike Noc

I've got a week's work in France starting Sunday - will be good to hear first hand what the word is on the street about our exit.

I for one will be very interested in your feedback - I look forward to it.

[Gman2]

Originally Posted by Polly

Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year

What a myopic view on life - what do you mean a "worthwhile job" for starters? Affording her own house - don't tell me your blaming the start of the UK house price rise in 1997 on the EU! You reckon many would like to turn the clock back to the work / life scenario that you've described above - I'm not holding my breath! Also I sincerely hope that Bob's aspirations for his daughter is not one of "staying at home looking after the children". Blimey I thought we'd moved on from this traditionalist un-progressive think but evidently not..

[bobthebuilder]

Polly, the point I was making, was that we used to have the EU to sort those kind of messes out. In particular the blockade of beef by the French was declared illegal and the French government (eventually) lifted the blockade. Without the EU and a legal framework to back it up, I can see a rise in petty disputes between us and other EU nations.

And yes Gman2, I am hoping for rather more than the Victorian lifestyle described for Bob junior when the time comes!