JagFire

[bl52krz]

Originally Posted by brianw

You can get the full story here in an interview with the Ipace driver. Very level headed he seemed too.
Straight from the horse's mouth with no spin.

https://youtu.be/6SVxmqS5_60?feature=shared

So according to the chap who drove this car, said the policeman told him it had happened before. Thinking about it, should they not all be recalled to find out what went wrong, before someone is killed by this happening during rush hour? No of course not. It will then show how the ‘self driving’ cars are even more unsafe. And this stupid government of ours is allowing cars to do autonomous driving on our roads.I am afraid we are going to read about people being killed by one of these abomination’s. There have already been accidents in America by these efforts.

[wraymond]

When you think about Jaguar handing the car back to him after their inspection and examination following a similar earlier event, you might start to think there was more to this than the event in itself. Surely Liability rears its head?

Also, he was very lucky he had only 10 miles ‘in the tank’ at the time. Or was he? That in itself is to most of us a rather big sin of omission in other circumstances. Range anxiety on a journey is bound to have quite another effect.

All this is hiding behind a massive wall of professional deafness. But exactly when did the motor trade cover itself in glory?

[KWIL]

There is also a case of a Tesla approaching a T junction, brakes did not work when applied and it went for a swim in the pond directly opposite.



New car sir? Swim never happened!

[brianw]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

So according to the chap who drove this car, said the policeman told him it had happened before. Thinking about it, should they not all be recalled to find out what went wrong, before someone is killed by this happening during rush hour? No of course not. It will then show how the ‘self driving’ cars are even more unsafe. And this stupid government of ours is allowing cars to do autonomous driving on our roads.I am afraid we are going to read about people being killed by one of these abomination’s. There have already been accidents in America by these efforts.

I could not agree more.
It is unbelievable that Jaguar did not do a serious investigation the first time this occured , just computer says all good. This needs a thorough investigation involving the engineers and those involved in writing tje software. In his account on you tube he states he was doing 120mph at times. The potential for causing a mass pile up involving innocent people was immense.
This must not be hushed up or swept under the carpet.
It sounds as if the driver involved, the Police and the call handler did the public a great service in avoiding a tragedy that day.

[bl52krz]

Originally Posted by SteveThackery

That's the problem - we've only got the bare bones. Even worse, told by a journo who doesn't know a servo from a slave cylinder and wants a dramatic story.

You do not lose your steering when you turn the key off. Try it on your own car - you'll see. You do lose the power steering, though, which might well be enough to overcome the driver's physical strength.

Steve. I tell you what to do, get in your car, and get on the m/way, accelerate up to 70 mph, and then turn your key back so that your engine stops. You would have to be very brave to do that with thought, never mind in a situation of complete brown trousers. You are telling me that you would have the forethought to only count the clicks of the key back to the first stage of moving the key from OFF. Let me tell you, you would be a very brave man to try it. As soon as you bring the key back to the key entering position, you panic. The reason being, you start trying to steer via the steering wheel and you find it is ‘stuck’, so you then panic and keep moving the wheel backwards and forwards which keeps the pressure on the steering lock, thereby stopping you from turning the wheel. The idea is good in thought, but not so easy in practice. Plus don’t forget you now have no brakes after two or three applications of the brake pedal. Not a situation I would like to be in.

[Gate Keeper]

Originally Posted by SteveThackery

Must have been absolutely horrifying!

I haven't understood why the cruise control failed to disengage. Pressing the brake pedal should disengage it. I wonder if the same fault that made the brakes fail also stopped the switch from working that disengaged the cruise control.

The brakes are dual circuit, so even if one circuit fails from a corroded pipe the other should still work. It does, though, increase the pedal travel a lot. Or maybe it was the servo that failed and the driver didn't, or couldn't, press the brake pedal hard enough. Once again, I find these accounts fascinating, but nobody has ever given a full technical account of exactly what went wrong and why. At least not one I can find. I suspect the manufacturers would want to cover up the details. On older cars there might not even be a detailed investigation - it'll just be put down to poor maintenance.

Yes it was frightening as I was a front seat passenger and unable to do anything. At the time all I could see was all of these smashed up cars and stationary emergency vehicles ahead of us getting closer and closer. I had not had time to speak to my wife or anyone else if we did not make it through. It was surreal and it felt like a bad dream, a living nightmare. No surprise Ed went into shock as a result.

I am not a mechanic, so can’t tell you why the cruise control failed to disengage or why the brakes failed other than what I had written about it above - I stated the facts.

I know after Ed turned the engine off and despite his stature of being big and powerful, he had great difficulty in steering the car until it eventually stopped.

At the time the police were not interested in towing the car away or impounding it, all they wanted to do was to prosecute the driver.

Nothing was ever mentioned about poor maintenance…...

Eventually the police case was dropped.

[daveo138]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

Steve. I tell you what to do, get in your car, and get on the m/way, accelerate up to 70 mph, and then turn your key back so that your engine stops. You would have to be very brave to do that with thought, never mind in a situation of complete brown trousers. You are telling me that you would have the forethought to only count the clicks of the key back to the first stage of moving the key from OFF. Let me tell you, you would be a very brave man to try it. As soon as you bring the key back to the key entering position, you panic. The reason being, you start trying to steer via the steering wheel and you find it is ‘stuck’, so you then panic and keep moving the wheel backwards and forwards which keeps the pressure on the steering lock, thereby stopping you from turning the wheel. The idea is good in thought, but not so easy in practice. Plus don’t forget you now have no brakes after two or three applications of the brake pedal. Not a situation I would like to be in.

Turning off the ignition does not engage the steering lock. That only happens when the key is removed.

[SteveThackery]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

[B][COLOR="Blue"]You are telling me that you would have the forethought to only count the clicks of the key back to the first stage of moving the key from OFF.

@daveo138 has beaten me to it. See his reply. It's been that way for decades.

I totally accept that the driver might panic and freeze up when the car first starts to run away. But this went on for 20 minutes (I think?), during which time he had enough composure to try selecting neutral repeatedly, for instance.

I don't know enough about the iPace - maybe there isn't an off-switch as such. The lack of detailed information about these two events is frustrating.

[wraymond]

For me, the whole thing is absolutely shocking, starting with Jaguar handing the car back to him after it happened the first time!

That, together with the apparent lack of publicity which could naturally have an effect, absolutely stinks. The damage to reputations could have had a catastrophic effect on sales.

Of course, we don’t know what was said to him at that time but it must have had the seriousness you might expect. Is it a coincidence that apparently that model is now discontinued? Was the owner advised to keep schtum? The thought of taking the family to the seaside....

[daveo138]

It would definitely be interesting to know what the dealer said about the issue the first time it happened.

My own experience of modern cars and main dealers is disappointing, to say the least. If the OB diagnostics don’t tell them anything, they haven’t got a clue, it would seem.