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Old 18th July 2019, 07:34   #21
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And when we get the same result again - will that stop the constant whining and whinging from those who didn’t get the result they wanted? Or will they insist on a third, and then another and another vote until they get the result they DO want.

The vote was taken

The result is in

Accept it.

PLEASE!

The last thing the country needs is to do what the EU has a history of doing whereby they simply keep repeating a vote because they didn’t get the vote they wanted!

I got the result I voted for, but I would have accepted the alternative result with good grace. I would not have been trying to insist on another vote, just because it hadn't gone the way I wanted.




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Old 18th July 2019, 07:55   #22
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I got the result I voted for, but I would have accepted the alternative result with good grace. I would not have been trying to insist on another vote, just because it hadn't gone the way I wanted.



As would I

However, I have a sneaky suspicion that had the vote gone the other way then those that got the result they wanted would be the first to insist that “their” result stood and no second referendum would be allowed.

There is no “impasse” IMO - what we have is a clear vote by the population to leave and that must be honoured.

The stumbling block is the out of touch MP’s in the HoC’s who despite supposedly representing the U.K. population actually present us with a HoC’s that is not in favour of “Leave”.

Those MP’s that want to Remain have tried all sorts of “dirty tricks” - including the most ridiculous of trying to remove the No Deal option from the negotiating table!!

It frankly beggars belief that these so called representatives of the people can seek to remove that most basic of negotiating options - the option to walk away.

Only if we have that option can you get BOTH sides to discuss what is best for both. To have to negotiate with both arms tied behind your back is more than crazy - it’s stupid!
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Old 18th July 2019, 08:39   #23
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As would I

However, I have a sneaky suspicion that had the vote gone the other way then those that got the result they wanted would be the first to insist that “their” result stood and no second referendum would be allowed.

There is no “impasse” IMO - what we have is a clear vote by the population to leave and that must be honoured.

The stumbling block is the out of touch MP’s in the HoC’s who despite supposedly representing the U.K. population actually present us with a HoC’s that is not in favour of “Leave”.

Those MP’s that want to Remain have tried all sorts of “dirty tricks” - including the most ridiculous of trying to remove the No Deal option from the negotiating table!!

It frankly beggars belief that these so called representatives of the people can seek to remove that most basic of negotiating options - the option to walk away.

Only if we have that option can you get BOTH sides to discuss what is best for both. To have to negotiate with both arms tied behind your back is more than crazy - it’s stupid!

Nigel Farage - currently leader of Brexit Party, said back in May 2016:

Nigel Farage warns today he would fight for a second referendum on Britain in Europe if the remain campaign won by a narrow margin next month.

The Ukip leader said a small defeat for his leave camp would be “unfinished business” and predicted pressure would grow for a re-run of the 23 June ballot.


Farage Said: “In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.”
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Old 18th July 2019, 09:33   #24
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Nigel Farage - currently leader of Brexit Party, said back in May 2016:

Nigel Farage warns today he would fight for a second referendum on Britain in Europe if the remain campaign won by a narrow margin next month.

The Ukip leader said a small defeat for his leave camp would be “unfinished business” and predicted pressure would grow for a re-run of the 23 June ballot.


Farage Said: “In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.”

Understandable I suppose, what's good for the goose...


Thing is the vote and re-voting could go on forever, who decides when enough is enough?




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Old 18th July 2019, 10:54   #25
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Understandable I suppose, what's good for the goose...


Thing is the vote and re-voting could go on forever, who decides when enough is enough?




I suppose since we all voted 3 years ago, and the positives AND negatives of leaving the EU has become much clearer, also a NO DEAL Brexit was never put forward as an option, then another vote should really be desired by both sides.

All of that being said if it ended up being another 52/48 to leave, then for me that would be the final decision.

But at least that would fully validate the original decision, made 3 years ago, with all the facts in the public domain.
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Old 18th July 2019, 12:38   #26
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I think the HoC and HoL are a mile away from being out of touch with the feeling in the real world.

They are acutely aware that their privileged inner world is under threat and in great danger of changing beyond their control. That’s the point, control.

That was the prime motivator three years ago and all that has happened since is the complete lack of any. It’s pointless and demeaning to revive all the old arguments as they only lead to rancour and a certain amount of vitriol.

It is however fair to say the upheaval in the establishment and the lengths to which ‘Honourables’ and ‘Right Honourables’ are prepared to debase our (unwritten) constitution, unwritten because we thought we were beyond the need for it to be so – we were better than that – is a national disgrace and they treat us all with the utmost disrespect whilst mockingly pledging allegiance to the flag. How’s that for the last refuge of scoundrels!

Several of the Blues – they don’t deserve the accolade of their respective parties- have even let it be known they intend bringing their own side down. That should result in instant recall and a constituency vote on their continued employment.
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Old 18th July 2019, 12:45   #27
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I suppose since we all voted 3 years ago, and the positives AND negatives of leaving the EU has become much clearer, also a NO DEAL Brexit was never put forward as an option, then another vote should really be desired by both sides.

All of that being said if it ended up being another 52/48 to leave, then for me that would be the final decision.

But at least that would fully validate the original decision, made 3 years ago, with all the facts in the public domain.
The “No Deal” scenario WAS clearly outlined by the Remain supporters - it was clearly set out in the “Project Fear” leaflets that were delivered to every house in the U.K. at a cost to the taxpayer of many £millions!

The doom and gloom predictions became ever more strident and scary! And were based upon the very worst case scenarios.

Even now we see headlines from the Remain Camps saying things like we would be “4% poorer” with a no deal Brexit - but dig down into where that 4% negative comes from and you find that the reality is that it comes from a “projection” that suggests GDP growth by 2030 is currently estimated to be 27% - but a No Deal Brexit “could” reduce that to 23%!!

The reality is slowly seeping out to businesses and people - for example WTO tariffs would average out at about 4% - but the current net payments we make to the EU of circa £8bn to £10bn a year equates to about 7% of exports.

So to say that the No Deal scenario was never presented is false - it keeps getting rammed down our throats via “Project Fear”.

But the old adage is very true.

You can fool some of the people some of the time but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time.

People have seen the intransigence of the EU - even some those who voted Remain accept the vote result and are appalled at the antics of the EU negotiators - as well as ours!!
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Old 18th July 2019, 13:30   #28
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The “No Deal” scenario WAS clearly outlined by the Remain supporters - it was clearly set out in the “Project Fear” leaflets that were delivered to every house in the U.K. at a cost to the taxpayer of many £millions!

The doom and gloom predictions became ever more strident and scary! And were based upon the very worst case scenarios.

Even now we see headlines from the Remain Camps saying things like we would be “4% poorer” with a no deal Brexit - but dig down into where that 4% negative comes from and you find that the reality is that it comes from a “projection” that suggests GDP growth by 2030 is currently estimated to be 27% - but a No Deal Brexit “could” reduce that to 23%!!

The reality is slowly seeping out to businesses and people - for example WTO tariffs would average out at about 4% - but the current net payments we make to the EU of circa £8bn to £10bn a year equates to about 7% of exports.

So to say that the No Deal scenario was never presented is false - it keeps getting rammed down our throats via “Project Fear”.

But the old adage is very true.

You can fool some of the people some of the time but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time.

People have seen the intransigence of the EU - even some those who voted Remain accept the vote result and are appalled at the antics of the EU negotiators - as well as ours!!


You will no doubt be shocked to know I disagree with much of what you said!

Anyway, the bottom line seems to be, that certainly in recent times, the Brexit Process - that is, exiting the EU, by any means, damaging or otherwise, is more important than the original vote to leave the EU with a deal, as promised by numerous Leave Supporters
Easiest deal in History.
They need us more than we need them.
They will and must give us a deal.
BMW will put extreme pressure on Germany to give us a good deal.
Sunny uplands.
To name a few.
Now it’s people knew they were voting for a no deal??

So here’s were we actually agree - you can fool some of the people all the time, fool all of the people some of the time, but not all the people all of the time.

StopPress: BJ’s foolish kipper stunt about the Isle of Man.
First - Isle of Man NOT in EU
Second - Ice Pack requirement is British Government requirement NOT EU.
Ah well, why let the truth get in the way of a story your supporters want to believe anyway!
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Old 18th July 2019, 13:43   #29
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Here we go again. Another post that has degenerated into a series of political points. Here's me thinking such posts were banned.... Never mind. I don't own a Rover any more though so no point in my contributing as apparently non Rover owners are not welcome
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Old 18th July 2019, 14:00   #30
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Anyone noticed, that Jeremy Hunt often wears on his label, one of the Rover Union Jack metal badges? The badge on the back door quarter panel.



He is wearing one now, in the Andrew Neil Interview BBC1.


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Here we go again. Another post that has degenerated into a series of political points. Here's me thinking such posts were banned.... Never mind. I don't own a Rover any more though so no point in my contributing as apparently non Rover owners are not welcome
Yes, I noticed and I must agree with Nick. My 2p's worth
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