Can't work in a care home

[wraymond]

Healthy Option

Confession time re post 184:

Given the obsession that anything coming from a GOV source, or the hallowed NHS sources, or the purely and naturally argumentative individuals who are convinced that because they believe it, it must be gospel, I must say a word of admiration for the apparent resistance to temptation to shut this thread as shown by Mods is amazing.

The up and rising antipathy being shown by some to those who choose not to be vaccinated are not helping their cause by slagging off any nay-sayers. Possibly the biggest and most valid reason for disbelief is a well trod and historical lack of appreciation for the truth. Never mind the whole and nothing but, even some of it might get a hearing if the sources could be trusted. They simply can’t. ‘They’ are liars to the marrow and have proven time after time they cannot be relied upon to tell the truth, or at the very least, anything approaching it. That’s healthy.

Now we have the inglorious nadir of being called names, being ‘excluded’, castigated, threatened, and eventually surely ostracised because of unproven theories. At worst being forced to undergo medical procedures en mass, oh no, who said that? Now, where have I heard that before? Well, at this rate it won’t be long.

Medical expert on TV tonight: for every 100 who get infected 1 will die, 4 will be very ill, and the rest will be not very ill.

Should I trust my life to a hastily discovered drug that is rushed with incredible haste into mass production? By and from companies that are even now hiking the price way beyond what it should be? Charging huge amounts for merely testing supposed patients?

I wouldn’t dream of telling anybody else what to do, out of old fashioned manners, but this ancient survivor intends to keep his head down.

[Saga Lout]

Originally Posted by wraymond

Healthy Option

Confession time re post 184:

Given the obsession that anything coming from a GOV source, or the hallowed NHS sources, or the purely and naturally argumentative individuals who are convinced that because they believe it, it must be gospel, I must say a word of admiration for the apparent resistance to temptation to shut this thread as shown by Mods is amazing.

The up and rising antipathy being shown by some to those who choose not to be vaccinated are not helping their cause by slagging off any nay-sayers. Possibly the biggest and most valid reason for disbelief is a well trod and historical lack of appreciation for the truth. Never mind the whole and nothing but, even some of it might get a hearing if the sources could be trusted. They simply can’t. ‘They’ are liars to the marrow and have proven time after time they cannot be relied upon to tell the truth, or at the very least, anything approaching it. That’s healthy.

Now we have the inglorious nadir of being called names, being ‘excluded’, castigated, threatened, and eventually surely ostracised because of unproven theories. At worst being forced to undergo medical procedures en mass, oh no, who said that? Now, where have I heard that before? Well, at this rate it won’t be long.

Medical expert on TV tonight: for every 100 who get infected 1 will die, 4 will be very ill, and the rest will be not very ill.

Should I trust my life to a hastily discovered drug that is rushed with incredible haste into mass production? By and from companies that are even now hiking the price way beyond what it should be? Charging huge amounts for merely testing supposed patients?

I wouldn’t dream of telling anybody else what to do, out of old fashioned manners, but this ancient survivor intends to keep his head down.

I think this thread is largely solid, it shows opinions that are not out of bounds, it's not a wild thread with conspiracy theories, it shows divisions reflected in wider society and it should be allowed to run its course. The virus is ongoing and the thread really reflects a lot of what's going on right now. The basic part of this is simple, vaccination or not? The thread is far from done as it gives insight into a broad section of people, far better than a poll or TV debate, it allows real time happenings to be talked about in the written word, I applaud that chance to discuss with normal people.

[Torqueofthedevil]

Originally Posted by wraymond

The up and rising antipathy being shown by some to those who choose not to be vaccinated are not helping their cause by slagging off any nay-sayers

A couple of facts:
1. At the point when the NHS is about to be overwhelmed, the country will go back into lockdown, as has happened before. We're not there yet, but it's perfectly conceivable that we will be in a few more weeks or months.
2. The vast majority of Covid patients are unvaccinated.
3. Those who are complaining now about being strong-armed into getting a jab will also be the first to complain about any further restrictions on day-to-day life, whether lockdown or anything else.

Luckily my family is relatively well-placed to endure another lockdown (much as I really hope there isn't one), but for many even the prospect of another one is really worrying, and the reality would be devastating. So it's hardly surprising that those people have little patience with the unvaccinated-and-so-far-uninfected, who are already piling a lot of totally avoidable pressure on the NHS, and who may yet be the catalyst for another lockdown.

Originally Posted by wraymond

Now we have the inglorious nadir of being called names, being ‘excluded’, castigated, threatened, and eventually surely ostracised because of unproven theories.

But the exclusion and perceived ostracism are voluntary! The jab comes with no financial cost, minimal time cost and (for the vast majority of people) minimal discomfort.

Originally Posted by wraymond

At worst being forced to undergo medical procedures en mass, oh no, who said that? Now, where have I heard that before? Well, at this rate it won’t be long.

No one is forcing you or anyone else to have a medical procedure, nor is this even being discussed! But if the current direction this country is taking seems too authoritarian for your liking, look at what is happening among our closest allies. Australia has stopped paying child benefit to unvaccinated parents;
meanwhile some of Canada's provinces have barred unvaccinated children from attending school. I'm not saying that I necessarily agree with either policy, merely offering a comparison.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by Alikris

Thought I'd look in on this thread. Good grief, I cannot believe people are still conversing with you on this. I honestly hope that no-one is taking your claims as the truth, because truth they are not.

Well said and all accurate.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by MSS

I agree with everything you say here. However, I would add that a person being convinced he/she is right whilst being wrong is not an uncommon occurrence and one could argue it is the person's right to remain in this state provided it does not lead to interfering with others' rights.

There is a danger that once we start to mandate vaccinations regardless of whether a person wishes to have one or not it will take us down a very dangerous path. Your post #24 when you spoke about rights etc. was in my view passionate and sincere but fundamentally wrong from the perspective of individual rights.

Phil - I do not remember such occurrences!

Normally I would agree, but the individual deciding they are unwilling to wear masks, or have the jab, are severally affecting the health, wealth, welfare and in some cases - the lives of others around them. Time it was made compulsory.

[Saga Lout]

Originally Posted by HarryM1BYT

Well said and all accurate.

Read my response before confirming you're an old duffer.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by Torqueofthedevil

Luckily my family is relatively well-placed to endure another lockdown (much as I really hope there isn't one), but for many even the prospect of another one is really worrying, and the reality would be devastating. So it's hardly surprising that those people have little patience with the unvaccinated-and-so-far-uninfected, who are already piling a lot of totally avoidable pressure on the NHS, and who may yet be the catalyst for another lockdown.

But the exclusion and perceived ostracism are voluntary! The jab comes with no financial cost, minimal time cost and (for the vast majority of people) minimal discomfort.

An additional option, unlikely, but something it might eventually be necessary to implement, is to deny those who have refused the vaccine medical assistance if and when the do get covid. Their choice to not have the jab, their problem to deal with the effects.



My big issue with those who are refusing to take precautions/ have the jab and etc. is the fact that they are trying to convince others to join them in their stupidity.

[Saga Lout]

Originally Posted by Torqueofthedevil

A couple of facts:
1. At the point when the NHS is about to be overwhelmed, the country will go back into lockdown, as has happened before. We're not there yet, but it's perfectly conceivable that we will be in a few more weeks or months.
2. The vast majority of Covid patients are unvaccinated.
3. Those who are complaining now about being strong-armed into getting a jab will also be the first to complain about any further restrictions on day-to-day life, whether lockdown or anything else.

Luckily my family is relatively well-placed to endure another lockdown (much as I really hope there isn't one), but for many even the prospect of another one is really worrying, and the reality would be devastating. So it's hardly surprising that those people have little patience with the unvaccinated-and-so-far-uninfected, who are already piling a lot of totally avoidable pressure on the NHS, and who may yet be the catalyst for another lockdown.



But the exclusion and perceived ostracism are voluntary! The jab comes with no financial cost, minimal time cost and (for the vast majority of people) minimal discomfort.



No one is forcing you or anyone else to have a medical procedure, nor is this even being discussed! But if the current direction this country is taking seems too authoritarian for your liking, look at what is happening among our closest allies. Australia has stopped paying child benefit to unvaccinated parents;
meanwhile some of Canada's provinces have barred unvaccinated children from attending school. I'm not saying that I necessarily agree with either policy, merely offering a comparison.

We once again get back into hype, the NHS has basically had an easy ride for 18 months, there you are, I've said it. The Doctors Surgeries have been much the same. Let's just step back and take a broad look at the NHS for the last 18 months, Covid wards...No visitors allowed to see loved ones on any wards because of Covid...departments not seeing patients because of Covid...Many treatments and surgeries postponed...People dying because of a lack of care...(my brother was one of them) ..but the question is a simple one..Why couldn't a Hospital function as normal? I could be in 5 supermarkets at the height of the virus, I took precautions and caught nothing. I had to be given the virus by the person I'm living with, I didn't get it from being careful myself. I have to say that your sheep like belief in the so called truth is worrying, I'm glad I won't need to rely on you in any situation where rational thinking is needed, you've been brainwashed by the hype and dare I say it, fake news.

[Torqueofthedevil]

Originally Posted by Saga Lout

I have to say that your sheep like belief in the so called truth is worrying, I'm glad I won't need to rely on you in any situation where rational thinking is needed, you've been brainwashed by the hype and dare I say it, fake news.

Wow! I didn't realize we had a world-class comedian in our ranks. What a treat, funniest thing I have read for ages

[Saga Lout]

Originally Posted by Torqueofthedevil

Wow! I didn't realize we had a world-class comedian in our ranks. What a treat, funniest thing I have read for ages

I'm in an enviable position you see, I'm not anti vax, I was desperate for a vaccine last year about this time, I watched the first one given on the news and was wringing my hands in anticipation of getting mine, I then got the virus. I knew after I recovered I didn't need the jabs after all and then sat on the fence, I don't need them but those cranks that think there's something in them are nutters, they amuse me to be honest but, you people that have sold your souls on the alter of vaccines are much the same, you're all certifiably mad with your beliefs in the power of the protection they offer, that's also alongside the belief that anyone without the vaccine walks around shedding virus with every step they take, have you any idea how insane that seems to a rational person? The virus is destroying itself as it was hoped it would, the divisions over this will never heal and you know what the sad thing is? It's the people that worship at the alter of the vaccines that have caused the divisions, the people that don't want or need them have simply said `leave us alone to make our own choices` the vaccine freaks have not let up with demands to punish those people to deliver what they themselves want. I'll be distancing myself from people that have been like this with me long after the virus has gone, you have a problem, get a vaccinated person around to sort it, I'm done with you, I got no support for my natural immunity and now you need me..FO. My future workload eased with the attitude of so called friends towards my status of not having the jabs. You choose the hysterical path or the path of knowledge, I know which I'm walking.