Are EVs really the answer in the future? I do not think so. - Page 34

andymc · 9th March 2020, 16:27

The time to worry about any rise in the price of electricity imported from France was almost four years ago ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by bl52krz

... and it is all stop and start for hours, normal in other words.

EVs are more efficient in stop-start traffic than ICE cars, in that when they are not moving, having the motor switched on consumes zero energy. They also consume less electricity to move at lower speeds than at higher speeds, again unlike ICE cars whose "urban" fuel consumption is always higher than "extra-urban". Whereas an ICE - despite the advent of stop-start systems such as the one that consistently fails on the MG6 I have driven quite a bit recently - will usually continue to burn fuel even at standstill.

The rest of what you've posted seems to be low on facts and high on catastrophic thinking, but the answers to the questions you've asked are readily available if you care to use your search engine of choice to look them up. Which I doubt, but to give you a head start on your learning journey I don't mind informing you that servicing and maintenance are cheaper for EVs than for ICE cars, that charging cables are armoured and that you might find it enlightening to investigate what the city of Dundee has been implementing.

Extra road wear and more potholes, deary deary me ...

wraymond · 9th March 2020, 18:21

Is it beyond the bounds of credibility that DVLA will have a statutory duty to inform electricity generating sources and suppliers that vehicle reg. no. XYZ is owned by Mr. Bloggs who lives at No.1, Brave New World Avenue....?

All that info is even now directly at hand and, presumably, freely available to generating companies on the smart meter charging magic roundabout (which they can switch off or selectively change the pricing elements) or read off likely charging habits? Would that not sow just one seed of doubt about the frantic scramble and massive financial incentives to install smart meters in every home? Or suffer huge breach of contract fines if they don't? Who's kidding whom?

Stevie25 · 9th March 2020, 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by wraymond

Is it beyond the bounds of credibility that DVLA will have a statutory duty to inform electricity generating sources and suppliers that vehicle reg. no. XYZ is owned by Mr. Bloggs who lives at No.1, Brave New World Avenue....?

All that info is even now directly at hand and, presumably, freely available to generating companies on the smart meter charging magic roundabout (which they can switch off or selectively change the pricing elements) or read off likely charging habits? Would that not sow just one seed of doubt about the frantic scramble and massive financial incentives to install smart meters in every home? Or suffer huge breach of contract fines if they don't? Who's kidding whom?

Your are indeed correct.
It is indeed beyond the bounds of credibility that the DVLA...................

Maybe in the future we will need to register with the Government when we purchase any item that consumes high amounts of Electricity eg Freezer, Fridge, Vacuum Cleaner, Washing Machine, Tumble Dryer, Electric Cooker, Immersion Heater etc ????
BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU !
Who just said the year is 1984? Oh you, well you are being sent to a Government Re-education Course!

mileshawk56 · 9th March 2020, 19:59

I am not an expert and was barely educated but why would the Government not increase the costs of running an electric motor vehicle? Its called tax. Chris S.

Stevie25 · 9th March 2020, 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by mileshawk56

I am not an expert and was barely educated but why would the Government not increase the costs of running an electric motor vehicle? Its called tax. Chris S.

In practical terms, I suspect that when the number of EV reaches a tipping point, and the Government income from VED falls, then VED will be applied.

wraymond · 9th March 2020, 21:40

By that time EV's will possibly be old fashioned and the source of 'free' energy, Hydrogen/atomic, will be even more expensive. We exist only to serve mammon, i.e. the supply and renewal of things that cost more money.

All hail the Great Leader.
Just one more Elysian reefer.

Lancpudn · 9th March 2020, 21:54

If we can afford BEV's we will be surely be on a yearly mileage tax coupled with GPS data or we'll all be on public transport or a bicycle.

Euro CAT 7 supposedly arrives in 2025 when the fleet average MPG jumps to 55.4 mpg, Sadly I can see the powers that be making it progressively expensive for older cars

coolguy · 10th March 2020, 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lancpudn

If we can afford BEV's we will be surely be on a yearly mileage tax coupled with GPS data or we'll all be on public transport or a bicycle.

Euro CAT 7 supposedly arrives in 2025 when the fleet average MPG jumps to 55.4 mpg, Sadly I can see the powers that be making it progressively expensive for older cars

Still probably cheaper to run older cars than suffer depreciation!

wraymond · 11th March 2020, 15:57

Want the alternative truth?: Enjoy.

https://principia-scientific.org/a-r...etic-required/

Rickoshea · 12th March 2020, 11:25

For some reason I get huge pleasure visiting this thread to read luddites expressing views that merely prove how little they understand of the matters that they are pontificating about. I feel the need to educate them so here goes!

1. Historically, electricity has been generated to meet demand. The problem with the move to renewable energy is that electricity production is driven by the weather and this clearly is not in line with demand. Our Masters have understood this for many years and are trying to address it with “smart” meters in the hope of altering demand to the amount of electricity being generate and the best (simplistic) mechanism is to charge more for electricity when it is short supply and less when it is in surplus - again to be delivered by “smart” meters.

2. Now the highest demand for electricity is usually early evening with everybody rushing home to make a cup of tea and prepare dinner. At the other extreme, there is stacks of electricity in the late evening and over night. EVs being charged during this period help address this issue - this is one of the reasons our Masters encouraging their adoption! We have had our car for 6 months and have done all our charging overnight and never had to rely on public charges. My reward for doing what our Masters want is the ability to get 250 miles of electricity for £6 overnight. Now if I used a public high speed charger during the day this cost would rise to £13 to £60 at the most expensive rate. There are also thoughts that once EVs are more widely adopted then they could be used to recharge at the night time cheap rate and also power the home when demand is highest. Since most home should use no more that 8kwhs during the day and most EVs should have batteries Ranging from 40 to 90kwhs then they should always be enough electricity in the EV for the usual family journeys as well as the house.

3. To all those who say they will never have an EV (without ever having driven one) think on this! EVs are likely to price match ICE cars within 5 years and progressively become cheaper. An EV has about 200 moving parts whilst an ICE car has 2,000 ish. It will therefore be much more reliable and cost almost nothing to maintain (no gearbox, no clutch, no anti pollution bits, no fuel injectors, fuel pumps, spark plugs exhaust etc.) The most braking is done by regeneneration so pads and disks should last 100,000 mile. It will hold the road better due to lower CG because of battery weight slung low. It will offer a silent ride and out accelerate the poor saps relying on bits of metal flying up and down to move. They are also likely to be built out of Aluminium meaning no tin worm to kill them off.

PS those with EVs but no driveway are already allowed to run a cable from their house to a car parked on the curb so long as the cable is protected by one of these to ensure no trip hazard! https://www.amazon.co.uk/Allcam-2-me...4014303&sr=8-5

PPS Why would the French not want to continue supplying us with the surplus nuclear powered electricity that they have. This is not an act of charity on their part - they are jolly grateful for our business. Perhaps you also think they will refuse to sell us wine and frocks!

PPPS the only drawback I could find when looking at getting the I Pace was the need to pay an annual “luxury” tax as the car cost over £40k. This was eliminated on all EVs in the budget yesterday - well done Chancellor!

9th March 2020, 18:21	#332
wraymond This is my second home 75 Auto 2.5 SE Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Westcliff on Sea Posts: 5,195 Thanks: 423 Thanked 1,680 Times in 1,014 Posts	Is it beyond the bounds of credibility that DVLA will have a statutory duty to inform electricity generating sources and suppliers that vehicle reg. no. XYZ is owned by Mr. Bloggs who lives at No.1, Brave New World Avenue....? All that info is even now directly at hand and, presumably, freely available to generating companies on the smart meter charging magic roundabout (which they can switch off or selectively change the pricing elements) or read off likely charging habits? Would that not sow just one seed of doubt about the frantic scramble and massive financial incentives to install smart meters in every home? Or suffer huge breach of contract fines if they don't? Who's kidding whom? __________________ member no. 235

9th March 2020, 21:40	#336
wraymond This is my second home 75 Auto 2.5 SE Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Westcliff on Sea Posts: 5,195 Thanks: 423 Thanked 1,680 Times in 1,014 Posts	By that time EV's will possibly be old fashioned and the source of 'free' energy, Hydrogen/atomic, will be even more expensive. We exist only to serve mammon, i.e. the supply and renewal of things that cost more money. All hail the Great Leader. Just one more Elysian reefer. __________________ member no. 235

9th March 2020, 21:54	#337
Lancpudn This is my second home MG ZS EV Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Lancashire Posts: 15,587 Thanks: 4,591 Thanked 3,427 Times in 2,565 Posts	If we can afford BEV's we will be surely be on a yearly mileage tax coupled with GPS data or we'll all be on public transport or a bicycle. Euro CAT 7 supposedly arrives in 2025 when the fleet average MPG jumps to 55.4 mpg, Sadly I can see the powers that be making it progressively expensive for older cars __________________ Blessed are the tea makers. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3b...auto-2000_auto Last edited by Lancpudn; 9th March 2020 at 22:11..

11th March 2020, 15:57	#339
wraymond This is my second home 75 Auto 2.5 SE Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Westcliff on Sea Posts: 5,195 Thanks: 423 Thanked 1,680 Times in 1,014 Posts	Want the alternative truth?: Enjoy. https://principia-scientific.org/a-r...etic-required/ __________________ member no. 235

12th March 2020, 11:25	#340
Rickoshea Loves to post Jaguar I Pace Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Surbiton Posts: 342 Thanks: 10 Thanked 74 Times in 47 Posts	For some reason I get huge pleasure visiting this thread to read luddites expressing views that merely prove how little they understand of the matters that they are pontificating about. I feel the need to educate them so here goes! 1. Historically, electricity has been generated to meet demand. The problem with the move to renewable energy is that electricity production is driven by the weather and this clearly is not in line with demand. Our Masters have understood this for many years and are trying to address it with “smart” meters in the hope of altering demand to the amount of electricity being generate and the best (simplistic) mechanism is to charge more for electricity when it is short supply and less when it is in surplus - again to be delivered by “smart” meters. 2. Now the highest demand for electricity is usually early evening with everybody rushing home to make a cup of tea and prepare dinner. At the other extreme, there is stacks of electricity in the late evening and over night. EVs being charged during this period help address this issue - this is one of the reasons our Masters encouraging their adoption! We have had our car for 6 months and have done all our charging overnight and never had to rely on public charges. My reward for doing what our Masters want is the ability to get 250 miles of electricity for £6 overnight. Now if I used a public high speed charger during the day this cost would rise to £13 to £60 at the most expensive rate. There are also thoughts that once EVs are more widely adopted then they could be used to recharge at the night time cheap rate and also power the home when demand is highest. Since most home should use no more that 8kwhs during the day and most EVs should have batteries Ranging from 40 to 90kwhs then they should always be enough electricity in the EV for the usual family journeys as well as the house. 3. To all those who say they will never have an EV (without ever having driven one) think on this! EVs are likely to price match ICE cars within 5 years and progressively become cheaper. An EV has about 200 moving parts whilst an ICE car has 2,000 ish. It will therefore be much more reliable and cost almost nothing to maintain (no gearbox, no clutch, no anti pollution bits, no fuel injectors, fuel pumps, spark plugs exhaust etc.) The most braking is done by regeneneration so pads and disks should last 100,000 mile. It will hold the road better due to lower CG because of battery weight slung low. It will offer a silent ride and out accelerate the poor saps relying on bits of metal flying up and down to move. They are also likely to be built out of Aluminium meaning no tin worm to kill them off. PS those with EVs but no driveway are already allowed to run a cable from their house to a car parked on the curb so long as the cable is protected by one of these to ensure no trip hazard! https://www.amazon.co.uk/Allcam-2-me...4014303&sr=8-5 PPS Why would the French not want to continue supplying us with the surplus nuclear powered electricity that they have. This is not an act of charity on their part - they are jolly grateful for our business. Perhaps you also think they will refuse to sell us wine and frocks! PPPS the only drawback I could find when looking at getting the I Pace was the need to pay an annual “luxury” tax as the car cost over £40k. This was eliminated on all EVs in the budget yesterday - well done Chancellor! __________________ Miss the 75

9th March 2020, 19:59	#334
mileshawk56 Posted a thing or two MGZT Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Berkshire Posts: 1,281 Thanks: 1,738 Thanked 299 Times in 216 Posts	I am not an expert and was barely educated but why would the Government not increase the costs of running an electric motor vehicle? Its called tax. Chris S.