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Old 15th December 2012, 18:17   #21
jymix
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Hi all,
I just replace the small belt right.
On the belt left I have this alignment


I don't know how to align pulley The Far Left pulley. Can I remove the two pulleys without risk?
someone has an idea?

Jymix
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Old 15th December 2012, 18:30   #22
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You can, but you don't have to. Besides, it would be difficult to untighten and to tighten back that bolt without the special locking tool.
Remove the one from the right only (intake camshaft). Then, using the belt if you pull from the lower side you can turn the shaft. The right position of the exhaust camshaft pulley is with the larger slot faced to the V cut and the line of the intake camshaft. Take care, sometimes the valve's springs tend to rotate the shafts in another position than the desired one, you may need to improvise to hold them.

I'm afraid you were right, the exhaust camshaft is about 60 degree behind the normal position and that means three or four teeth.

Nota bene: the camshaft bolts are TTY (torque to yeld), if you want to do everything by the book you should use new bolts. (I didn't, but that's on my own risk)
...and never hold the camshaft from the other end to tighten a bolt. You may break it it had not been designed to take so much torque.
Good luck!
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Old 15th December 2012, 22:31   #23
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Firstly, if the engine is in safe mode, you can turn all these sprockets to your hearts delight, the pistons are halfway, and will never touch.

I don't even know (can't remember) if you have to loosen the bolt to get the belt off, but it is possible you have. but with the bolt in place you can get the exact position by putting a wrench on the bolt and moving it here.

The torque on these bolts is stupid high, I must admit, I don't know why, but I would imagine it has a lot to do with old days, and fearing a bolt coming loose owing to vibration.

I always use a bit of Loctite on bolts such as these and even the pulley bolt, and I give them a good torque, but nowhere what is recommended. The Loctite will make sure they go nowhere.

Three teeth, possible valve interference on some of the valves. You can pick that up on the cam followers/lifters. A bent valve will normally not close fully, even when the cam is off contact. Any lifter that does not come to the top when the cam is off, is suspect.

Good luck.

Oh, and to anticipate a future question, the answer is NON.
What is the question?



The belt looks very slack, so new ones are required, no doubt.
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Old 16th December 2012, 09:01   #24
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Hi all,

Still in Safe Mode:
to align the second pulley, I had the following choices:
1 - turn the pulley in the direction of clockwise (135 °) or
2 - Turn the pulley in the opposite direction clockwise (225 °)

I made the choice "1". Is this the right choice?

Then I prepared and installed the belt by tightening the bolts

I tried to start the engine but it doesn't start.

@ Workaholic, do I position my pulleys like your picture to replace your belts?
because in save mode, the hollow part of the mark of the right pulley is inside then it is outside in your pic. Does the pic was taken in Safe Mode?

Watching the video replacement belts that Workaholic recommended me. Just before tightening the bolts, the technician turns the camshaft approximately 45 degrees in the opposite direction clockwise using tool 18G 1747/4 and a key.

How to get there without any tools or enough room to put something could turn to? At this point there are pipes of the cooling circuit, the level pipe oil and the the hydraulic system tank. And camshaft, I have a new but how should I proceed to put in place?

I ask myself these questions since 3am

Thank you again for your help
Good Sunday to all
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Old 16th December 2012, 09:24   #25
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The sprockets have a "square" near the centre, each. These squares must face each other, in other words, point towards each other.

You should not try and start the car before you have checked all variables.

You don't need any special tools. Just align the marks in a line, and the engine is timed. You can see, if one sprocket is a tooth out, then just do it again.

I am just thinking that with this movement, and trying to start, you would have to be very lucky not to have bent some of the valves. Don't do anything like trying to start. Rather remove all plugs and turn it carefully by hand. Get hold of compressed air, and blow it into each cylinder when the cams are off the lifters. Listen for air escaping through either the inlet throttle body or the exhaust. If you hear that, then the valves are not closing properly, which would mean they have been bent.

Whichever way you turn the sprockets doesn't matter at all, as long as the final position is correct.

I would not change any camshaft, unless there is some damage we haven't heard about.

A general piece of advice. Don't panic, and don't to turn try the engine over on the starter, as a matter of fact, disconnect the battery completely and don't connect it again, before we tell you to. You are likely to do more damage than good with the battery connected.

Be prepared to take the heads off, I have a feeling this is where this could well end..
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Old 16th December 2012, 10:19   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jymix View Post
Hi all,

Still in Safe Mode:
to align the second pulley, I had the following choices:
1 - turn the pulley in the direction of clockwise (135 °) or
2 - Turn the pulley in the opposite direction clockwise (225 °)

I made the choice "1". Is this the right choice?

Watching the video replacement belts that Workaholic recommended me. Just before tightening the bolts, the technician turns the camshaft approximately 45 degrees in the opposite direction clockwise using tool 18G 1747/4 and a key.
I have to do that to? (Whith or without the tools)?
.......
Thank you again for your help
Good Sunday to all
I think I need to view photos because I did not understand everything you say.
I try to be accurate for me to understand despite my bad English.
I've aligned the pulleys then I turned the engine manually and started the engine.

Your advice is correct. I wouldn't have had to start the engine without doing what you say. I did not everything. In fact I'm not a mechanic. This is why I need to know if what I've done is right. Forgive me if the answers to my questions are obvious to you. But this isn't the case for me.

In addition, I'm all alone in a small village a bit special and nobody wants to help me.

If you could answer my questions, then it would allow me to apply your instructions

Your conclusion is probably just as two months ago, I forced several times to start the engine.
I'll take pictures of the small belt the most damaged.

Thank you Kaiser

Last edited by jymix; 16th December 2012 at 10:28..
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Old 16th December 2012, 12:50   #27
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Watch carefully the video at 7:32. The key slot of the intake camshaft is aligned, because it is hold in position by the front (long) cambelt. The exhaust camshaft is free to move and the key slot is NOT aligned (take a look at the attached picture). The valves springs makes it "jump" to a less tensioned position. He uses that wrench to turn the shaft back to the aligned position, otherwise the pulleys don't fit. If you don't remove the exhaust pulley (and you don't have to), you don't need access to the front part of the engine at this stage. You can use the belt fitted to the pulley to turn the exhaust shaft, or, as kaiser said, you may use a wrench.
It doesn't matter if you align the pulleys with the "V" oriented inside or outside as long as:
1. the crankshaft is in safe position.
2. you do it the SAME for all four camshafts, frond cylinder bank and rear cylinder bank.
3. the V is faced to the LARGER square slot or if the V is oriented to outside, then the larger slot is outside too (as in my picture with the red line).
Yes, the engine is locked in the safe position in my picture, but one revolution in front (or one revolution behind, it is the same thing) compared to the book, which correspond to a half revolution (180 degrees) on the camshafts.
I have to point out here that beside following the instructions it is very important to understand how it works. Good luck again!

Attached Images
File Type: jpg rear cambelt.jpg (45.0 KB, 142 views)
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Last edited by workaholic_ro; 16th December 2012 at 12:56..
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Old 16th December 2012, 13:10   #28
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I know this video almost by heart even if this video pulleys are different from ours.
If I tell you that I already start the engine it is because the pulleys have been aligned and tightened.

The question I have now is this:

Watching the video replacement belts that you recommended me. Just before tightening the bolts (7:50) http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=...ture=endscreen, the technician turns the camshaft approximately 45 degrees in the opposite direction clockwise using tool 18G 1747/4 and a key.
I have to do that to?

Last edited by jymix; 16th December 2012 at 13:36..
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Old 16th December 2012, 14:18   #29
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I started my previous post with this. He is doing it because the exhaust shaft jumps to a stable position, it is not aligned anymore. Some valves are opened and their springs tend to push the cams back, turning the shaft. Please take a look at the picture again. You NEVER have to touch that end of the shaft or to remove the rubber caps if you don't use the special tools kit.

Edit:

Clear now ?



Edit: I don't know what happened with the picture, trying to upload again:

Attached Images
File Type: jpg missalignment.jpg (68.9 KB, 115 views)
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Last edited by workaholic_ro; 17th December 2012 at 14:46..
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Old 16th December 2012, 14:31   #30
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I would like to post pictures directly without using http:// ...
How is it done?

If not in safe mode, my pulleys are properly aligned. Si j'arrive à poster mes images, tu le verras
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