Would you buy a heavy 4x4 for safety reasons

[stevestrat]

My father ended up with a Suzuki XL-7 Grand Vitara purely because of my mother's arthritis, she couldn't get in/out of a normal car. I inherited it when he passed away, nice enough car but only had it a few weeks when a tool in a Freelander flew out of a side road and torpedoed me, write off.

[macafee2]

Originally Posted by Dallas

Its quite funny really, after all these years the 4x4 still gets a bad reputation by the enemy, and now the SUV has simply made things worst by creating more discrimination.

I bought my first 4x4 20 years ago, and the same discrimination was around back then. Nothing has changed except the technology that is used to make these vehicles, plus the ever increasing safety standards that aid to the design in the first place.

We have all seen the common small car become bigger over the years, small cars are no longer small, and that's part of the problem. My old 1992 Isuzu/Opel/Vauxhall Frontera was huge back in the day, but in today's standards would be considered quite small, just a large estate car.

Today's 4x4's and SUV's cant even fit in some parking spaces due to their size, this is a safety standard manufacturing design problem where technology is to blame. The enemy needs to keep up with what is going on around them, we don't live in the dark ages any more do we.

Technology rules.

I remember my wife wanting the Frontera due to it being more modern looking than the Trooper, we then went of to a Nissan/Ford Maverick after that.

why do they need to be 4 wheel drive?
I wonder what % go off road where 4 wheel drive is a must.
There is indeed a % but what do people think it is?

macafee2


macafee2

[Dallas]

Originally Posted by macafee2

why do they need to be 4 wheel drive?
I wonder what % go off road where 4 wheel drive is a must.
There is indeed a % but what do people think it is?

macafee2


macafee2

... and along came the SUV, I've always said the SUV was born out of the 4X4 that doesn't get used off-road.

[Darcydog]

Originally Posted by macafee2

why do they need to be 4 wheel drive?
I wonder what % go off road where 4 wheel drive is a must.
There is indeed a % but what do people think it is?

macafee2


macafee2

They are not 4x4 on Tarmac - you usually engage 4x4 via a differential lock when going off road. Some have 1st gear as a “crawler” gear - and others have a upper and lower range gearbox.

So in normal driving - they are two wheel drive.

The above is a bit simplistic because many have things like traction control, Hill descent control or limited slip differentials that add value to the basics of how you achieve all-wheel-drive.

[slovcan]

These days 4x4 has become a "catch-all" term encompassing part time 4WD, full time 4WD and AWD. All or most manufacturers build AWD cars. So, an Audi Quattro is OK. However, when that same platform (chassis) and drivetrain is installed under a body with higher boxier profile like a high roof estate/wagon/combi suddenly it is an evil 4x4 beast.

BTW, the above scenario is more 4x4 than what the original and existing true 4x4's are. As was said, real 4x4 are part time - selectable - whereas the AWD variety are 4x4's all the time.

Logic has fled and common sense has been bred out of the more recent generations.

Cheers,
Glenn

[bl52krz]

Nothing wrong with 4x4 vehicles, it is just the attitude they tend to engender in the driver. One of invincibility comes to mind. Bullying also comes to mind. The bullying can be seen every day by young women taking and leaving with their children to schools throughout the country. Please don’t tell me it does not happen or is a rare occurrence, I live 100 yards from a primary school and if I am there when leaving or arriving at the school with there children, it happens. A bit like the 20 mph limit on the road for their child’s safety that is ignored all the time. 4x4’s are not needed in this country, only on farms or if you live out in the sticks for when the snow comes,not very often.

[bl52krz]

Originally Posted by Dallas

Its quite funny really, after all these years the 4x4 still gets a bad reputation by the enemy, and now the SUV has simply made things worst by creating more discrimination.

I bought my first 4x4 20 years ago, and the same discrimination was around back then. Nothing has changed except the technology that is used to make these vehicles, plus the ever increasing safety standards that aid to the design in the first place.

We have all seen the common small car become bigger over the years, small cars are no longer small, and that's part of the problem. My old 1992 Isuzu/Opel/Vauxhall Frontera was huge back in the day, but in today's standards would be considered quite small, just a large estate car.

Today's 4x4's and SUV's cant even fit in some parking spaces due to their size, this is a safety standard manufacturing design problem where technology is to blame. The enemy needs to keep up with what is going on around them, we don't live in the dark ages any more do we.

Technology rules.

I remember my wife wanting the Frontera due to it being more modern looking than the Trooper, we then went of to a Nissan/Ford Maverick after that.

Your post suggests that you think all the ‘other people’ are wrong, but not yourself. Why do you think people think that way about 4x4 vehicles?

[Darcydog]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

Nothing wrong with 4x4 vehicles, it is just the attitude they tend to engender in the driver. One of invincibility comes to mind. Bullying also comes to mind. The bullying can be seen every day by young women taking and leaving with their children to schools throughout the country. Please don’t tell me it does not happen or is a rare occurrence, I live 100 yards from a primary school and if I am there when leaving or arriving at the school with there children, it happens. A bit like the 20 mph limit on the road for their child’s safety that is ignored all the time. 4x4’s are not needed in this country, only on farms or if you live out in the sticks for when the snow comes,not very often.

This is certainly not restricted to SUV’s or 4x4’s. I would suggest Volvo drivers are the worst when it comes to “bullying antics” on the road.

As for school parking and dropping off area - the worst driver I have ever seen was a lady with a face perpetually like a smacked bottom who is so angry she drives like an idiot with no thought for others at all.

And she drives an old Seat.

[slovcan]

True 4x4 is a safety and practicality benefit in snow, ice, mud, gravel to some extent and general loose surface conditions, not only for off-road use.

AWD, on the other hand, provides the above benefits PLUS is noticeably more secure on WET roads of ALL surfaces.

Cheers,
Glenn

[Mr Bone]

Originally Posted by bl52krz

Nothing wrong with 4x4 vehicles, it is just the attitude they tend to engender in the driver. One of invincibility comes to mind. Bullying also comes to mind. The bullying can be seen every day by young women taking and leaving with their children to schools throughout the country. Please don’t tell me it does not happen or is a rare occurrence, I live 100 yards from a primary school and if I am there when leaving or arriving at the school with there children, it happens. A bit like the 20 mph limit on the road for their child’s safety that is ignored all the time. 4x4’s are not needed in this country, only on farms or if you live out in the sticks for when the snow comes,not very often.

From what I see on our roads, that attitude is not the reserve of 4x4 drivers. Young women (and there are exceptions before a host of proud Fathers spit back) are the most ignorant. Their sense of entitlement is astounding, be it at junctions, in car parks, and especially on motorways.

Van drivers ( again, there are exceptions ) are the most dangerous. Motorway tailgating, erratic lane swapping without indication),oh,....and jumping out wanting a fight when they dream they are being challenged is becoming more common.


4x4s are need in this country, by the people who choose to buy them, it's their choice. Using similar reasoning to yours, soft tops are not needed due to our miserable weather. MPVs wouldn't be needed either, why not buy a van and put seats in the back.

As we have seen in this thread, some people buy a specific type of vehicle to meet their needs, and some because they want one, and may it always be so. The people who openly criticise with blanket statements that a type of vehicle has no place on our roads, or that a type of vehicle is some form of compensation for a childishly perceived mental or physical deficiency are wrong. On the latter they should be ashamed of themselves.

Your choice is yours, I don't think you are wrong because I didn't make it. We all need to learn to live and let live rather than venting our disagreement about other peoples choices.