K-engine project - A possible low cost rebuild?

[beinet1]

Hi all,
A little report back after the last evenings activity.
Crankcase and crankshaft was cleaned and made ready for re-assembly.
New main bearings and thrust bearings installed in block and crank ladder:



Crankshaft installed in block. Crankshaft endfloat now measured to 0,1mm with feeler gauges.

sealant added to the block mating face:

Crank ladder installed and bolted down with the recommended torque:

New crankshaft seal installed. Remember to apply some sealant to its flange prior to installation as specified by MGR/Haynes:

Block put back in the engine stand and a new uprated oil ladder temporary installed. It could be discussed if this was really necessary but since everything is put to pieces, I decided to fit it just for the piece of mind.. J

Liners temporarily fitted to the block without sealant and clamped down with liner retainers. By using the “finger test”, all liners protrude above the block deck. By using a steel ruler and feelers, I could get my 0.0015 blade under the straight edge, but not my 0.002 blade. This is within OEM spec and should be OK.

This far was how I got yesterday. Next step will be to pull the liners and install them with sealant and fixed with liner retainers. Then a piston job will be the nest step…. J

[kaiser]

http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=101494

see pictures 2 and 3 in particular.

[beinet1]

Originally Posted by kaiser

http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=101494

see pictures 2 and 3 in particular.

Hi Kaiser,

Thanks for the response.
I have seen through your thread several times. I am not surprized that coolant leak into oil through the liner seal occours some times. I have pulled the liners on 4 K-engines and has always bees surprized over that I could not find any traces from the OEM sealant. It is also a possibility that a liner leak could occour if the liners has been disturbed during its life during a HGF repair or something. The two ones I have put together using hylomar and shims, has until this day not seen any coolant/oil mixture, so I am pretty confident with using hylomar only. According to Des Hammils book, some garages has for practice to add spray-hylomar to the lower part of the liner and block bore in addition to the hylomar on the ledge prior to assembly. I think the most important thing is to keep the parts degreased and clean prior to assembly and make sure you get some hylomar in between the upper part of the block bore and liner + at the liner ledge.
Some part of me tells me that I should avoid fixing the liners with loctite as this will create some kind of tension between the block and liners as these expands with different rates at temperature due to different materials. On the other hand, its a very good idea
I guess no one of these alternatives is rigth or wrong and will probably work well

[kaiser]

That is not what I am trying to show you.
If you look carefully, where does it look like the water has come from?

The square hole? Looks like that to me, so maybe it would be best to seal the whole surface, and not just the round holes?

Looks like a slip up from the factory/Haynes etc.

[kaiser]

As for sealing the bottom of the liner with Loctite.
There will certainly not be any undue tensions. Normally a liner is a press fit into the block over the full length of the liner, and that works well. Here you are only sealing less than a third of the length, I would guess. No contest.
In any case my engines have both been locked, and none have shown any water loss after that.

[beinet1]

Originally Posted by kaiser

That is not what I am trying to show you.
If you look carefully, where does it look like the water has come from?

The square hole? Looks like that to me, so maybe it would be best to seal the whole surface, and not just the round holes?

Looks like a slip up from the factory/Haynes etc.

Ahh... now I see

But as far as I know... There are no coolant channels that deep into the block? I guess that "both sides" of the square hole is towards the sump area? I will take a closer look at this....

For all I know, you migth have had water in the oil (not mixed) which has find its way into those holes and seeped down through the "gap" between the block and crank ladder??? (just speculation?)

[lovema75]

This thread is truly fascinating, yet I find it disturbing when looking at the engines that so many critical sealing areas rely on thin layers of sealant! While the K series was lauded for advanced construction it seems to be a little under- engineered at times, and more for the benefit of manufacture rather than practical service life.

Next can you do an auto box rebuild...

[beinet1]

Originally Posted by lovema75

This thread is truly fascinating, yet I find it disturbing when looking at the engines that so many critical sealing areas rely on thin layers of sealant! While the K series was lauded for advanced construction it seems to be a little under- engineered at times, and more for the benefit of manufacture rather than practical service life.

Next can you do an auto box rebuild...

Thanks for that
An autobox rebuild would be quite an exciting task and I would take the challenge if I have had a spare box to work on

[lovema75]

You can have mine - it's junk anyway...

[beinet1]

Originally Posted by kaiser

As for sealing the bottom of the liner with Loctite.
There will certainly not be any undue tensions. Normally a liner is a press fit into the block over the full length of the liner, and that works well. Here you are only sealing less than a third of the length, I would guess. No contest.
In any case my engines have both been locked, and none have shown any water loss after that.

I guess that applies to engines with cast iron blocks which have the same temperature expansion rate as for the press fit liners.

As said, nothing of this is either rigth or wrong, it purely depends on the "gut feeling" for what is rigth or not. As long as you got some hylomar down into the liner bore in the block, I think it is sufficient

That you have loctited two engines, proves that this migth be a way to go. Wonder if Rover has experimented with different liner fixing alternatives during their deveopment??

From my work experience as a mechanical design engineer, I have found out that there is often a good reason why mechanical designs/solutions/procedures are made the way they are. This is often a step-back when trying to change excisting designs to the better..