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Old 24th June 2016, 19:41   #1001
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Originally Posted by maxi_crawf View Post
Actually I think you will find Morgan Stanley are not moving, just a bit more tittle tattle being put about, probably to stir it up!
Indeed - more "glass half empty" spherical objects

"A spokesman for Morgan Stanley told the Independent that the reports were untrue and that the bank has no immediate plans to make changes."



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Originally Posted by Nantwich 75 View Post
I wonder how the vote to remain in 1975 would have gone if it had been possible to see how the Common Market evolved into the EU.
Now that is a key question indeed!

Last edited by Dragrad; 24th June 2016 at 23:38.. Reason: Consecutive posts - use the edit or Multi-quote :-)
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Old 24th June 2016, 19:46   #1002
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Originally Posted by bobthebuilder View Post
I'm a very bad loser over this because people like my 15 year old daughter are going to suffer over this.



The thread started this morning was generally talking about the consequences of the Leave vote, which is why it's a real shame the threads were merged.


Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year


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Old 24th June 2016, 19:49   #1003
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Originally Posted by Polly View Post
Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year


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I'm a bit young to remember any of that but well said all the same
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:03   #1004
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It ain't sour grapes but the issues are stacking up that I doubt most who voted out had a scoobies on the big picture issues.
  • Messers Johnson and Gove want to take time to gather their thoughts before deciding the next steps. The EU want the UK to leave as soon as and aren't going to hang around until the Conservative party conference - why should they Brussels are now in the driving seat and it can't be seen that the tail is wagging the dog so the new team better be on the ball.
  • The deal that Cameron got in February that included safeguards for The City will now be scrapped.
  • The world markets that the EU had negotiated access to on our behalf will be withdrawn leaving us to re-negotiate back into the markets we were already in
  • The break-up of the UK is now a real possibility.
  • Oh - and the bilateral agreement we have with the French in Calais will be raised with the French Government. Yeah - might be separate to the EU but this will give leverage for the border to be moved back to Dover. You reckon we've got much support elsewhere to keep the status quo - I doubt it
.

But hey ho we need to make the best of it and move forward together and hopefully this new vision for the UK that BREXIT has promoted will come to pass.
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:11   #1005
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I'm not just worried about jobs and house prices (don't see what they have to do with the EU though TBH).

There are all the other benefits of EU membership I'm disappointed we might lose. Will a future government repeal legislation protecting workers rights? As I've posted many times before, who will prosecute big business to prevent restrictive practices (Microsoft etc). The EU might now be too weak to pursue the tax avoidance of Ebay and Google etc. People scoff but cleaner beaches, cheaper mobile phone charges, the regulation of cigarette advertising, compensation for late flights etc were all positive additions to our lives. Not to mention the right to retire or work in the EU.
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:15   #1006
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Originally Posted by bobthebuilder View Post
If we had sufficient 'right stuff' we wouldn't have run away from the EU, we would have stayed and worked to improve things, throwing our toys out of the pram will get us nothing.



As I stated in the new thread from the morning, I believe a lot of people voted as they did as a protest against the ills of the country. Austerity, lack of NHS investment, too little decent housing and the fact that the majority of people in 'poverty' are actually in households that contain a paid worker. It was too easy for the Leave side to sweep up this dissatisfaction and lay it at the door of immigration. I'm not referring to all the people in this thread, just listening to the reasons people cite in TV and radio interviews.



Now what happens if Spanish or French fishing boats come and fish in our territorial waters? Who sorts it out without the EU?



If the French ever block our beef imports as they did in the CJD crisis, who will sort that out?



And more importantly, if my daughter and Klarzy's son go galavanting around Europe in a few years together, love Milan so much they decide to stay an extra week by funding it by working in a bar, I assume that is now illegal? Be interested to hear if not.


You have just hit the right spot.....
1: The Spanish and French fishing boats do fish in our waters, with the EU blessing.
2: And you're right again, the French did block our Beef imports, and did it again recently by dumping truck loads on the highway, and I can't remember the EU rushing to resolve either issue
3: I don't pay my taxes so that yours and Klarzys kids can enjoy a holiday in Europe.


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Old 24th June 2016, 20:28   #1007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polly View Post
Don't you think there might be a possibility that your daughter might actually end up with a proper worthwhile job, and maybe even be able to buy her own house?
You see we oldies can remember a time when a house could be bought for roughly a years wage. We can also remember when a woman could stay at home and look after her own children, and as a result, never complained about the lack of childcare. We can remember when those in work paid for a pension for the older generation, their parents and grandparents, because we respected the sacrifices they had made to enable us to grow up during a period that the only choices you had were to work or starve. We can also remember when holidays consisted of one day at Christmas, and maybe a week during the summer, when if you were lucky, you could spend a few days by the seaside. We can also remember when we were told that having large families (more than two) was horrendously bad, but that new technology was going to make life so much easier. We would have much more leisure time, and would even be able to retire early in order to leave jobs for the young.
And do you know what.... We actually enjoyed life, and we enjoyed being there caring for our elders and our children.
The bit I can't remember, is being told that the next generation would be a selfish lot that would begrudge their elders even the very air that the breath, in order that they could have three foreign holidays every year
What a myopic view on life - what do you mean a "worthwhile job" for starters? Affording her own house - don't tell me your blaming the start of the UK house price rise in 1997 on the EU! You reckon many would like to turn the clock back to the work / life scenario that you've described above - I'm not holding my breath! Also I sincerely hope that Bob's aspirations for his daughter is not one of "staying at home looking after the children". Blimey I thought we'd moved on from this traditionalist un-progressive think but evidently not..
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:35   #1008
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Originally Posted by Gman2 View Post
It ain't sour grapes but the issues are stacking up that I doubt most who voted out had a scoobies on the big picture issues.
  • Messers Johnson and Gove want to take time to gather their thoughts before deciding the next steps. The EU want the UK to leave as soon as and aren't going to hang around until the Conservative party conference - why should they Brussels are now in the driving seat and it can't be seen that the tail is wagging the dog so the new team better be on the ball.
  • The deal that Cameron got in February that included safeguards for The City will now be scrapped.
  • The world markets that the EU had negotiated access to on our behalf will be withdrawn leaving us to re-negotiate back into the markets we were already in
  • The break-up of the UK is now a real possibility.
  • Oh - and the bilateral agreement we have with the French in Calais will be raised with the French Government. Yeah - might be separate to the EU but this will give leverage for the border to be moved back to Dover. You reckon we've got much support elsewhere to keep the status quo - I doubt it
.

But hey ho we need to make the best of it and move forward together and hopefully this new vision for the UK that BREXIT has promoted will come to pass.
I think you will find that the French have already said that they will still honour the bilateral agreement.
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:40   #1009
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I think you will find that the French have already said that they will still honour the bilateral agreement.
I've got a week's work in France starting Sunday - will be good to hear first hand what the word is on the street about our exit.
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Old 24th June 2016, 20:42   #1010
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Polly, the point I was making, was that we used to have the EU to sort those kind of messes out. In particular the blockade of beef by the French was declared illegal and the French government (eventually) lifted the blockade. Without the EU and a legal framework to back it up, I can see a rise in petty disputes between us and other EU nations.

And yes Gman2, I am hoping for rather more than the Victorian lifestyle described for Bob junior when the time comes!
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