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Old 21st May 2018, 17:10   #1
Darcydog
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Default Ken Livingstone resigns from the Labour Party

I’d like to say he has done the honourable thing.

But in my opinion there is nothing honourable about this slimy toad of an individual at all.

And my apologies to Bufonidea everywhere
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Old 21st May 2018, 18:26   #2
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Twould be impolite of me to voice my opinion regarding the question of his honour, so far as I can recall he has never displayed any.

He has plenty of chutzpa though (although that might be perhaps a word about which he would feign ignorance), and cunning. I suspect his resignation (which will bear no cost to him) comes at the thought of the upcoming enquiry into anti-Semitism within the party. If he is not a member, he can't be questioned.
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Old 21st May 2018, 18:38   #3
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Historically the Semites were an Arab people...
Is it not arabs they are trying to (to put it politely) eject from Palestine......??

So anti Semite is anti Arab..... not anti Jewish if the historical records are accurate...

I just can't get my head around the insane politics surrounding this region and clinging to an account of victimisation when they are now the victimisers of a less powerful nation...

I also understand genetic geniology testing is shunned in the region is due to the close familial relations that the opposing sides have...

Flogging a dead horse comes to mind in the futility of the whole conflict..
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Old 21st May 2018, 18:57   #4
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I think that's a lot of the problem. If you are critical of anything Israel does you are branded as an anti-admire and by association as loathsome as a Nazi.
This has been extended to anyone who has not condemned someone who has criticised Israel as an anti-semite you must be an anti-semite by association. If you attend a meeting where another attendee has been accused of being an anti-semite then you are equally loathsome. If you argue with this you are in denial that you have a problem. If you don't ostracise these people you are failing to deal with the problem.
It's very depressing that hatred is being whipped up in an effort to keep a clueless and divisive government in power.
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Old 21st May 2018, 19:24   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SideValve View Post
I think that's a lot of the problem. If you are critical of anything Israel does you are branded as an anti-admire and by association as loathsome as a Nazi.
This has been extended to anyone who has not condemned someone who has criticised Israel as an anti-semite you must be an anti-semite by association. If you attend a meeting where another attendee has been accused of being an anti-semite then you are equally loathsome. If you argue with this you are in denial that you have a problem. If you don't ostracise these people you are failing to deal with the problem.
It's very depressing that hatred is being whipped up in an effort to keep a clueless and divisive government in power.
In any university, or any other establishment that has been indoctrinated into social justice groupthink, you will find exactly the opposite is true.
Criticism of Israel is compulsory, Palestine can do no wrong.
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Old 21st May 2018, 21:28   #6
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It wasn’t his overt anti Semitic utterances that made me loath this man. It was the way he introduced the pay to enter zone in London by way of altering the phasing of traffic lights in the previous weeks and months and then putting the phasing right when charging was introduced so as to make congestion charging appear to work.

That and the idiotic way he ran the GLC means to me he is an arrogant idiot.

As for his more recent comments - yes - it simply shows that for certain sections of the Left one side in a crazy war can do no wrong. Which is ridiculous given that particular “side” gets up to even against its own.

IMO - there is no right or wrong in the Arab vs Israeli conflict - just bigotry pure and simple on both sides.

Livingstone is a classic example.
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Old 22nd May 2018, 07:41   #7
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IMO - there is no right or wrong in the Arab vs Israeli conflict - just bigotry pure and simple on both sides.

A perfect summation of the whole problem if I may say so. Well put. Not dissimilar to the Irish Troubles.
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Old 22nd May 2018, 11:21   #8
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Anti-Semitism.


These and other terms are the result of attempts by many recorders of history to define ethnicity and racial origins of diverse peoples of what is now northern and eastern Europe. We all know that histories are written long after the events, coloured by the beliefs and inclinations of the writers, and in the light of the socio/politico climates of their respective times. They rely on previous accounts of events for ‘evidence’ – not exactly proof, is it?

On top of this is the heavily weighted subject of religions and tribal loyalties still in existence today.

The word itself comes from tribes that spoke a certain language and relates to the use of the descriptive shem. To conflate Jews and Arabs is of course accurate in antiquity but misleading in modern terms.

The Middle East is an uncomfortable combination of widely diverse development of tribal affairs which is not helped by evangelists who use a range of philosophies to fit their religious dogma.

In the present context the term anti-Semitic is almost entirely used in connection with mainly 20C Europe and frequently limited to Jews in Germany, so within living memory and adding to the selective revulsion of bigotry led hatred.

Livingstone alleges that in the 1930’s there was a concerted effort of collusion by Jewish leaders to persuade Hitler to help in the establishment of a state homeland for them. This collusion of course is now seen as heresy and, in the light of later events, the ultimate anti-Semitic activity. So the disgust for those events provides the basis of further hatred.

Livingstone maintains he was factually correct and that he was either misunderstood or misquoted. He wasn’t the first and won’t be the last. He won’t withdraw his remarks so, under the guise of not wanting to harm his party, he is doing the noble thing and falling on his sword. Yeah, right.
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Old 22nd May 2018, 13:30   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wraymond View Post
Anti-Semitism.


These and other terms are the result of attempts by many recorders of history to define ethnicity and racial origins of diverse peoples of what is now northern and eastern Europe. We all know that histories are written long after the events, coloured by the beliefs and inclinations of the writers, and in the light of the socio/politico climates of their respective times. They rely on previous accounts of events for ‘evidence’ – not exactly proof, is it?

On top of this is the heavily weighted subject of religions and tribal loyalties still in existence today.

The word itself comes from tribes that spoke a certain language and relates to the use of the descriptive shem. To conflate Jews and Arabs is of course accurate in antiquity but misleading in modern terms.

The Middle East is an uncomfortable combination of widely diverse development of tribal affairs which is not helped by evangelists who use a range of philosophies to fit their religious dogma.

In the present context the term anti-Semitic is almost entirely used in connection with mainly 20C Europe and frequently limited to Jews in Germany, so within living memory and adding to the selective revulsion of bigotry led hatred.

Livingstone alleges that in the 1930’s there was a concerted effort of collusion by Jewish leaders to persuade Hitler to help in the establishment of a state homeland for them. This collusion of course is now seen as heresy and, in the light of later events, the ultimate anti-Semitic activity. So the disgust for those events provides the basis of further hatred.

Livingstone maintains he was factually correct and that he was either misunderstood or misquoted. He wasn’t the first and won’t be the last. He won’t withdraw his remarks so, under the guise of not wanting to harm his party, he is doing the noble thing and falling on his sword. Yeah, right.

But when you fall on your sword, its meant to be pointy end up...
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Old 22nd May 2018, 17:44   #10
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Legend has it he has brandished his sword on more than one occasion.
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