Cold air feed and filter upgrade

Simon · 6th December 2006, 21:51

Hainvg discussed this in a previous (hijacked) thread between myself, M47Rman and MartinW, amoungst others I decided to create this new thread detailing exactly what I did and what the result is after I 'modified' my KV6 air feed. The previous thread was just us mostly throwing ideas around but here's what actually happened along with some quantifiable results.

This morning, Mr.Postman delivered my ITG foam pannel filter which will help the car breathe a lot more easily than the standard paper filter.

Then came the hacking and screwing and pulling and tugging and general contorting body into strange shapes to remove the 'shannon tube' from the lower half of the airbox. This is a photo of the tube in place (borrowed from Kandyman, so I hope you don't mind

) The tube is the woven tube with mud splattered on it.

This tube is easy to remove with the bumper removed, but I managed to do it by removing the lower quarter-pannel from the underside of the car along with the headlight access pannel. Not the easiest thing to do through these holes but managable.

The next thing is to remove the blanking plate from inside the front bumper (ZT bumper, pre-facelift. Not sure about other bumpers)

A big thanks to MartinW for his original instructions on how to do this mod, so I suppose all the spoils should go to him for showing me how its done

My findings are in the next post...

Simon · 6th December 2006, 22:00

The original air feed tube pointed into a small gap just in front of the wheel arch liner. This location suffers from restricted air flow (the tube points at large metal structures) and from air that is warm and non-moving from the engine bay.

This original set up allows low-density warm air to feed the engine which is not ideal.

The new set up which draws air directly from outside via a free-flowing tube with unrestricted access allows the engine to breathe as it should - with cold, denser air.

The results from my test drive confirm it all.

Pre-mod results: Engine bay hot, coolant hot, filter box and inlet manifold all hot to touch. Engine response is as everyone knows (poor bellow 3000rpm and sometimes suffers if you put your foot down on an incline when the revs are low, even if your road-speed is high).

Post-mod results: Engine bay hot. Coolant hot. Filter box and inlet manifold are cold to touch (approximately that of outside air temperature). Engine response is improved (freer revving below 3000rpm and a much better response when you put your foot down in a high gear, regardless of road speed).

All in all, I'd say we have a conclusive result. Success!

The next stage is sorting the actual bumper hole out propperly. At the moment there is potential for water-ingress into the air feed. Unfortunately the shannon tube was too brittle and non-plyable to allow me to construct a U-bend in it to help stop water intake. I will continue to look into ways to make this set up a bit more weather-friendly!

Once again a big thanks to M47Rman for his expert advice and to MartinW for his original idea!

:lol:

MartinW · 6th December 2006, 22:07

Simon
Glad to hear that I was not just imagining my improvements, too! Superb to hear you have found the same benefits.

Keep us posted on the upgrade and for anyone wanting to see my finished article and mods, look below my signature for the link...

M47Rman · 7th December 2006, 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simon D

The original air feed tube pointed into a small gap just in front of the wheel arch liner. This location suffers from restricted air flow (the tube points at large metal structures) and from air that is warm and non-moving from the engine bay.

This original set up allows low-density warm air to feed the engine which is not ideal.

The new set up which draws air directly from outside via a free-flowing tube with unrestricted access allows the engine to breathe as it should - with cold, denser air.

The results from my test drive confirm it all.

Pre-mod results: Engine bay hot, coolant hot, filter box and inlet manifold all hot to touch. Engine response is as everyone knows (poor bellow 3000rpm and sometimes suffers if you put your foot down on an incline when the revs are low, even if your road-speed is high).

Post-mod results: Engine bay hot. Coolant hot. Filter box and inlet manifold are cold to touch (approximately that of outside air temperature). Engine response is improved (freer revving below 3000rpm and a much better response when you put your foot down in a high gear, regardless of road speed).

All in all, I'd say we have a conclusive result. Success!

The next stage is sorting the actual bumper hole out propperly. At the moment there is potential for water-ingress into the air feed. Unfortunately the shannon tube was too brittle and non-plyable to allow me to construct a U-bend in it to help stop water intake. I will continue to look into ways to make this set up a bit more weather-friendly!

Once again a big thanks to M47Rman for his expert advice and to MartinW for his original idea!

:lol:

Thanks for the mention Simon. Very good news that you have engineered an improvement. I look forward to seeing your weather proofing improvments in the near future - particularly topical at the moment as it is persisting down with rain here!
Andy:lol:

Simon · 7th December 2006, 20:31

Thanks for the suport guys. :lol:

Looking for some gauze now to make a debris-stop in place of the blanking plate as well as finding some suitable drain pipe (who'd have thought it would fit?!

) to make a labrynth. Hopefully it'll be done in a few days so I'll get some photos up of the finished product soon.

Next tuning stop.... exhaust system, ECU remap...? Who knows....!

MartinW · 7th December 2006, 20:42

Don't forget to follow the link in my signature to see the how-to on fitting a new back-box. Moto-build is good, not sure about Xpower as I haven't heard theirs, but the M/B one certainlys bring a nice gruff growl in at 2-3000rpm.

If you want, next time I am passing Lichfield you can have a listen to mine.

My next step is the new cam belts, new brakes, new tyres...

EXPENSIVE TIME! I was tempted at one point by the group buy elsewhere for the camshafts and vernier pulleys, but I think I shall get the MGOC w/s to try and up load the 75 map...

Good luck with the gauze and labrynth!

Kandyman · 7th December 2006, 22:17

Martin is it worth doing the plumbers mod on mine R75 2.0L as mine is pictured above and I'm having trouble getting hold of a new one ?

The front of the 75 dosent have the the gap/blanking plate like your ZT did to mount the air intake there, any ideas ?

MartinW · 7th December 2006, 22:24

Probably worth trying, it can only be cheaper, even if you have to make a snorkel arrangement to prevent water ingress. Agreed, you probably won't get the same benefit as the ZT gets with the vent, but no doubt you are more interested in a water-proof arrangement.

GreyGhost · 7th December 2006, 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kandyman

Martin is it worth doing the plumbers mod on mine R75 2.0L as mine is pictured above and I'm having trouble getting hold of a new one ?

The front of the 75 dosent have the the gap/blanking plate like your ZT did to mount the air intake there, any ideas ?

Any pipework will do as long as it is the same cross section and takes approximately the same route. Is the original flexible one closed off in any way at the bottom end to prevent debris entering or is it open?
Failing a replacement I would be of a mind to remove it, recover the damaged sections by wrapping Gaffer tape around it. Providing it does not actually touch an overy hot components then it should last for some time, at least until a replacement comes on stream.

Simon · 7th December 2006, 23:05

The shannon tube does not touch any hot engine components and actually points away from the engine block itself.

The tube is woven to allow air to pass through it but in reality air normally passes in through the open top (the bit that is normally sitting in front of the wheel arch liner, just behind the headlight acess plate)

Removing the shannon tube completely will leave the lower part of the air filter box open. If this is too low for your liking to risk water intake then normal drainpipe should fix onto it and allow you to construct a similar set up by having a pipe point upwards towards the wheel arch liner. Getting the pipe (especially a long one) into place is going to be the tricky part so you may have to remove the front bumper to give yourself sufficient access.

It depends on how much protection you want for your engine. The OEM set up is to provide the most protection from water/debris intake, while mine and Martin's intakes are designed for maximum cold air intake. Perhaps a comprimise between the two setups would suit yourself?

Hope this helps!

6th December 2006, 21:51	#1
Simon Banned - Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: - Posts: 10,318 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts	Cold air feed and filter upgrade Hainvg discussed this in a previous (hijacked) thread between myself, M47Rman and MartinW, amoungst others I decided to create this new thread detailing exactly what I did and what the result is after I 'modified' my KV6 air feed. The previous thread was just us mostly throwing ideas around but here's what actually happened along with some quantifiable results. This morning, Mr.Postman delivered my ITG foam pannel filter which will help the car breathe a lot more easily than the standard paper filter. Then came the hacking and screwing and pulling and tugging and general contorting body into strange shapes to remove the 'shannon tube' from the lower half of the airbox. This is a photo of the tube in place (borrowed from Kandyman, so I hope you don't mind ) The tube is the woven tube with mud splattered on it. This tube is easy to remove with the bumper removed, but I managed to do it by removing the lower quarter-pannel from the underside of the car along with the headlight access pannel. Not the easiest thing to do through these holes but managable. The next thing is to remove the blanking plate from inside the front bumper (ZT bumper, pre-facelift. Not sure about other bumpers) A big thanks to MartinW for his original instructions on how to do this mod, so I suppose all the spoils should go to him for showing me how its done My findings are in the next post...

6th December 2006, 22:00	#2
Simon Banned - Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: - Posts: 10,318 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts	The original air feed tube pointed into a small gap just in front of the wheel arch liner. This location suffers from restricted air flow (the tube points at large metal structures) and from air that is warm and non-moving from the engine bay. This original set up allows low-density warm air to feed the engine which is not ideal. The new set up which draws air directly from outside via a free-flowing tube with unrestricted access allows the engine to breathe as it should - with cold, denser air. The results from my test drive confirm it all. Pre-mod results: Engine bay hot, coolant hot, filter box and inlet manifold all hot to touch. Engine response is as everyone knows (poor bellow 3000rpm and sometimes suffers if you put your foot down on an incline when the revs are low, even if your road-speed is high). Post-mod results: Engine bay hot. Coolant hot. Filter box and inlet manifold are cold to touch (approximately that of outside air temperature). Engine response is improved (freer revving below 3000rpm and a much better response when you put your foot down in a high gear, regardless of road speed). All in all, I'd say we have a conclusive result. Success! The next stage is sorting the actual bumper hole out propperly. At the moment there is potential for water-ingress into the air feed. Unfortunately the shannon tube was too brittle and non-plyable to allow me to construct a U-bend in it to help stop water intake. I will continue to look into ways to make this set up a bit more weather-friendly! Once again a big thanks to M47Rman for his expert advice and to MartinW for his original idea! :lol:

6th December 2006, 22:07	#3
MartinW Newbie MG TF LE500 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Chester Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Simon Glad to hear that I was not just imagining my improvements, too! Superb to hear you have found the same benefits. Keep us posted on the upgrade and for anyone wanting to see my finished article and mods, look below my signature for the link...

7th December 2006, 20:31	#5
Simon Banned - Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: - Posts: 10,318 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts	Thanks for the suport guys. :lol: Looking for some gauze now to make a debris-stop in place of the blanking plate as well as finding some suitable drain pipe (who'd have thought it would fit?! ) to make a labrynth. Hopefully it'll be done in a few days so I'll get some photos up of the finished product soon. Next tuning stop.... exhaust system, ECU remap...? Who knows....!

7th December 2006, 20:42	#6
MartinW Newbie MG TF LE500 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Chester Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Don't forget to follow the link in my signature to see the how-to on fitting a new back-box. Moto-build is good, not sure about Xpower as I haven't heard theirs, but the M/B one certainlys bring a nice gruff growl in at 2-3000rpm. If you want, next time I am passing Lichfield you can have a listen to mine. My next step is the new cam belts, new brakes, new tyres... EXPENSIVE TIME! I was tempted at one point by the group buy elsewhere for the camshafts and vernier pulleys, but I think I shall get the MGOC w/s to try and up load the 75 map... Good luck with the gauze and labrynth!

7th December 2006, 22:17	#7
Kandyman Banned ROVER 75 2.5 V6 Connoisseur SE Limousine 2004 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Welling Posts: 10,995 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Martin is it worth doing the plumbers mod on mine R75 2.0L as mine is pictured above and I'm having trouble getting hold of a new one ? The front of the 75 dosent have the the gap/blanking plate like your ZT did to mount the air intake there, any ideas ?

7th December 2006, 22:24	#8
MartinW Newbie MG TF LE500 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Chester Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Probably worth trying, it can only be cheaper, even if you have to make a snorkel arrangement to prevent water ingress. Agreed, you probably won't get the same benefit as the ZT gets with the vent, but no doubt you are more interested in a water-proof arrangement.

7th December 2006, 23:05	#10
Simon Banned - Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: - Posts: 10,318 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts	The shannon tube does not touch any hot engine components and actually points away from the engine block itself. The tube is woven to allow air to pass through it but in reality air normally passes in through the open top (the bit that is normally sitting in front of the wheel arch liner, just behind the headlight acess plate) Removing the shannon tube completely will leave the lower part of the air filter box open. If this is too low for your liking to risk water intake then normal drainpipe should fix onto it and allow you to construct a similar set up by having a pipe point upwards towards the wheel arch liner. Getting the pipe (especially a long one) into place is going to be the tricky part so you may have to remove the front bumper to give yourself sufficient access. It depends on how much protection you want for your engine. The OEM set up is to provide the most protection from water/debris intake, while mine and Martin's intakes are designed for maximum cold air intake. Perhaps a comprimise between the two setups would suit yourself? Hope this helps!