Just Voted ??

[Gman2]

Well not the result I was hoping for

I'm not a big fan for the SNP or Tories but they've played a blinder and fair play to them. Independence for Scotland firmly back on the agenda that's been reported? I think not for the mo' - DC said he didn't want to see the Union break up "on his watch" so he's unlikely to do so in the next five years. Scottish politics has seen a massive re-alignment but the economics has stayed the same and so have the arguments. How many voted SNP for anti - austerity rather than Independence Undoubtedly though there are many parts of the UK where government from Westminster is virtually an irrelevance.

The Tories - a proud track record of delivery? Here's some for starters:

• Child poverty on the increase and will have increased in the UK by 39% by 2020 according to the Institute of Fiscal Studies.
• The use of foodbanks has increased.
• If migration is your bag - the ONS recorded an increase last year that was well short of the tens of thousands promised by Cameron.
• The party for business - 50% of SME's fail within the first couple of years due to bank fund starvation, legislation and other factors.
• Employment at an "all time low". HMRC have recorded a drop in tax receipts because the bulk are low paid and low skilled jobs on which struggling families are unable to build a future.

Yes the deficit is important but at what cost? I can tell you - at the cost of a fairer and more equitable society and the prospect of opportunity for all a distant goal for most.....

[Bolin]

Originally Posted by topman

on the wider point about different voting systems, the public voted firmly against a change 4 years ago. I guess it's what people want.

That vote was about AV, which isn't a very good system as a second choice gets the same amount of 'clout' as the first choice.

Originally Posted by MrDoodles

The vote we had 4 years ago, was for the alternative vote system, which wasn't wanted by anyone!

On a true PR system, the SNP would have 32 MP's and UKIP would have 81 MP's, which would represent the true wishes of the UK Electorate!

Yep, I only voted for AV as a stepping stone to PR, not because I ultimately wanted AV.

Originally Posted by bikerdude666

I have to say that while PR may seem fairer, I can't see how it would benefit the country. We would end up with continual coalition governments, so still no one would get what they wanted. Things would get done even slower. The system we have is simple, vote tactically on a general election, and vote for the smaller parties for councils etc where it will actually make a difference.

Many countries have continual coalition governments which work perfectly well - and with coalition, more of the electorate are represented in Government, so more people get what they want, although I accept that they will not get every single thing that their chosen party has promised.

Originally Posted by topman

In fairness that's what people said about the coalition and it lasted 5 years. Many councils work in coalition as do the Scottish and Welsh gov as do many around the world. I can't see any reason it wouldn't work here.

AGREE

Originally Posted by Gino

Although PR seems fairer and more democratic, as someone has already said, it would lead to more coalitions and minority governments. As we have had the First Past The Post system we generally, not always!, have stable governments and are less prone to radical parties or revolution.
Italy is a good example of weak governments due to repeated coalitions, or Germany before the rise of Hitler.
Although we may be forever stuck with the three main parties, I think its not necessarily a bad thing...

Nothing wrong with coalitions on principle, as I have said above - but minority governments are often not a good thing. there are exceptions, but generally coalitions are better than minority rule.

Issues with Italy and Germany 1929-33 are more to do with rubbish politicians rather than the PR system. It works fine if politicians co-operate and work together. There can be big problems when they don't, but you can have problems in majority governments when those in the same party don't pull together.

I don't see why we would be forever stuck with just three main parties, I think this election has shown the opposite to be true - but the unfair and unrepresentative current voting system is not as democratic as is needed in light of the new split of UK votes.

[Woof25]

Originally Posted by coolguy

I can! If we had proportional representation we would never have a majority Government - can you imagine the horse-trading that would go on? We would end up with basket case Governments like Italy!

Or successful ones like Germany! Oh ye of little faith give us some credit

[Woof25]

Originally Posted by Terrorfex

Are we "English" and "Scottish" taxpayers now? Dangerous road to go down I think ...

Yes we are logically the money to meet the concessions made to Scotland Wales and N I will come from revenue raised in the main and another by English taxpayers, I am aware that oil and other external holdings will contribute but I believe my original point was true. If Scotland chooses to become independent good luck to them although it has been well documented that it would be a very difficult and hard road for them to travel. To misquote Churchill 'The united kingdom may not be perfect,but its the best solution we have'
Think twice before you cut isn't bad advice either. Only time will tell I guess.