Go Back   The 75 and ZT Owners Club Forums > The 75 and ZT Owners Club Forums > Technical Help Forum
Register FAQ Image Gallery Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read
Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 20th January 2018, 19:59   #1
macafee2
This is my second home
 
Rover 75 Saloon & Tourer

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 14,890
Thanks: 1,630
Thanked 3,032 Times in 2,181 Posts
Default weight of steering when engine off

When the engine is off the steering is very heavy, remember those times when cars did not have power steering?

How much of the resistance as a rough % is the weight of the car via the tyres onto the road and how much is it the power steering system?

macafee2
macafee2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th January 2018, 21:02   #2
oswestryalex
Loves to post
 
Rover 75 1.8T connoisseur saloon 2003 in blue , MG ZT 190+ 2003

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Oswestry
Posts: 308
Thanks: 159
Thanked 99 Times in 57 Posts
Default

As a 'feel' from a car on ramps and turning the wheel, I would say 50% - but that is no more than a gut level guess.
oswestryalex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th January 2018, 21:48   #3
rrobson
I really should get out more.......
 
75 tourer cdti, MG ZS 180, nissan terrano & 1.8t rover 25

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Pontefract
Posts: 2,642
Thanks: 17
Thanked 295 Times in 218 Posts
Default

Depends on which engine the cars got. The diesel and v6 will have a higher percentage on the front axle than the 1.8's but they definitely aren't a car that has a 50/50 weight distribution. Also depends on how much fuel you've got in it as well!!

Realistically though it's probably going to be 60-65% of the weight of the car on the front wheels
__________________
How to view a car - everything you need to help you inspect a used car

VIS motor tester avalible to local members

Injector removal tool and auto gearbox pressure tester now available
rrobson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th January 2018, 22:01   #4
macafee2
This is my second home
 
Rover 75 Saloon & Tourer

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 14,890
Thanks: 1,630
Thanked 3,032 Times in 2,181 Posts
Default

not so much weight I'm after but the amount of resistance you feel when turning the steering wheel with the engine off. How much of that resistance is car to road and how much is it the power steering being forced?

macafee2
macafee2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 08:17   #5
klarzy
This is my second home
 
none but not gone

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: March, Cambs
Posts: 16,437
Thanks: 894
Thanked 4,247 Times in 3,025 Posts
Default

Remember non power steering is geared differently as well so will take less muscle to turn....
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]….All praise Bananaswan….
klarzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 09:41   #6
hogweed
I really should get out more.......
 
Vauxhall Insignia CDTi; MG TF 135

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Norn Iron
Posts: 2,942
Thanks: 942
Thanked 378 Times in 297 Posts
Default

Possibly not a particularly useful observation, but way back in the days (25 years ago) when old Hogweed was an arrogant young(ish) salesman hurtling around the countryside in a bright red Astra GSI 16V, one day a power steering hose burst.

The car had very fat tyres, and a small steering wheel. It was virtually un-drivable – just about manageable if you kept the speed up, but impossible at very low speeds. You really felt like the steering wheel was going to break off trying to turn the car at walking pace
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Astra.jpg (28.0 KB, 8 views)
__________________
Past cars: MGB GT; Escort 1300 Sport; Vauxhall VX4/90; Marina Coupe TC; Celica ST (1972); Montego Turbo; Astra GTE 16V; Astra GSI 16V; Golf GTI 16V (Mk II); Sierra XR4x4 Estate; BMW 325i (E30); BMW M3 3.0; BMW M3 3.2 Evo. Left some of the more embarrassing ones out. And about 30 motorbikes.
hogweed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 09:58   #7
macafee2
This is my second home
 
Rover 75 Saloon & Tourer

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 14,890
Thanks: 1,630
Thanked 3,032 Times in 2,181 Posts
Default

Reason for my question, I was always taught not to turn the steering wheel when stationary as it puts a lot of strain on the steering components and can damage what is beneath the wheels.
I'm trying to gauge how much of the steering resistance of our cars with the engine off
is due to contact with road and steering components but not including power steering components.

I seem to recall our Ford Escort Hatchback and Orion were heavy as neither had power steering

macafee2

Last edited by macafee2; 21st January 2018 at 10:00.. Reason: comment
macafee2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 11:21   #8
wullie480
This is my second home
 
wullie480's Avatar
 
1

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Banned
Posts: 5,195
Thanks: 528
Thanked 1,022 Times in 786 Posts
Default

You could maybe try and work it out but would depend on different factors.

You could jack car up so wheels are off the ground and with airbag removed use a torque gauge to turn wheels or maybe a force gauge on the wheel to see what force is required to move the wheel. This would give you the pressure required for steering alone. Repeat the same with wheels on ground and that would give you the force required to move the wheels deduct the force of the steering alone and you may have the answer your looking for.
It’ll differ from car to car depending on engine type,tyre make,tread depth road condition, even mileage on the components themselves etc.
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

Last edited by wullie480; 21st January 2018 at 11:26..
wullie480 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 11:34   #9
topman
This is my second home
 
topman's Avatar
 
MG ZT-T 190

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lincolnshire
Posts: 5,493
Thanks: 372
Thanked 647 Times in 534 Posts
Default

Seems to me if you wanted to know, you'd have to use a push-pull gauge. Attach the gauge to the steering wheel. Move the steering wheel x amount of degrees then do the same with the engine running. That would tell you the difference.
__________________
Like being creative?

http://www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail/
topman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st January 2018, 11:41   #10
HarryM1BYT
This is my second home
 
HarryM1BYT's Avatar
 
75 Contemporary SE Mk II 2004 Man. Sal. CDTi 135ps, FBH on red diesel, WinCE6 DD

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Leeds
Posts: 17,273
Thanks: 2,160
Thanked 2,061 Times in 1,586 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by macafee2 View Post
not so much weight I'm after but the amount of resistance you feel when turning the steering wheel with the engine off. How much of that resistance is car to road and how much is it the power steering being forced?

macafee2
Easy....

Take the weight off the tyres by jacking it up it, you will then find it turns fairly easily. None power steering heavy cars, tended to have more turns lock to lock, to give more leverage. I still managed to nearly rip my shoulder out parking Granadas with no power steering.
__________________
Harry

How To's and items I offer for free, or just to cover the cost of my expenses...

http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...40#post1764540

Fix a poor handbrake; DIY ABS diagnostic unit; Loan of the spanner needed to change the CDT belts; free OBD diagnostics +MAF; Correct Bosch MAF cheap; DVB-T install in an ex-hi-line system; DD install with a HK amp; FBH servicing.

I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
HarryM1BYT is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 21:18.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright © 2006-2023, The Rover 75 & MG ZT Owners Club Ltd