Just Voted ?? - Page 8

MrDoodles · 9th May 2015, 06:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by topman

i suppose you could say the SNP won 95% of the seats they contested, which they did. UKIP only one seat. I suppose that's the rules of the game.

on the wider point about different voting systems, the public voted firmly against a change 4 years ago. I guess it's what people want.

The vote we had 4 years ago, was for the alternative vote system, which wasn't wanted by anyone!

On a true PR system, the SNP would have 32 MP's and UKIP would have 81 MP's, which would represent the true wishes of the UK Electorate!

topman · 9th May 2015, 06:46

Possibly so. I'm just wary of parties proclaiming it wants x y or z because it's better for democracy, when what they really mean is its better for us. How many would want a system that made them worse off but was more democratic? Not many I'd bet!

Nothing personal or aimed at any one party just my general thoughts on the whole PR/AV thing.

Kennyeth · 9th May 2015, 07:01

Seeing as a few has put some views and not to political, her`s mine
£12 Billion in welfare cuts, God help us!
Ken.

bikerdude666 · 9th May 2015, 07:35

I have to say that while PR may seem fairer, I can't see how it would benefit the country. We would end up with continual coalition governments, so still no one would get what they wanted. Things would get done even slower. The system we have is simple, vote tactically on a general election, and vote for the smaller parties for councils etc where it will actually make a difference.

Oh and yes god help us having cuts, much better we keep spending money we don't have and getting in more debt. Time to get another credit card, this 1's maxed out….

topman · 9th May 2015, 07:50

In fairness that's what people said about the coalition and it lasted 5 years. Many councils work in coalition as do the Scottish and Welsh gov as do many around the world. I can't see any reason it wouldn't work here.

Gino · 9th May 2015, 08:15

Although PR seems fairer and more democratic, as someone has already said, it would lead to more coalitions and minority governments. As we have had the First Past The Post system we generally, not always!, have stable governments and are less prone to radical parties or revolution.
Italy is a good example of weak governments due to repeated coalitions, or Germany before the rise of Hitler.
Although we may be forever stuck with the three main parties, I think its not necessarily a bad thing. I think its the local elections where our votes really make a difference.
Its just a shame they never seem to have a public presence unless its voting time.

FLYER · 9th May 2015, 08:30

Now this funny...

Just heard a political commentator on the radio say that although the Scottish Labour Party are in the phone book it might be better to try to contact them by Ouija board.

wraymond · 9th May 2015, 09:19

Zero hours contracts are a hedge against vexatious and aggressive claims for wrongful or constructive dismissal by staff against employers. Cameron has stated that there will be a move to abolish Human Rights legislation which should have some effect on this situation.
Not too sure about PR, it sounds reasonable but there are problems that follow good intentions throughout politics (the law of unintended consequences).
Maybe the problem with FPTP is the size and demarcation of constituencies. They tend to be polarising in political objectives and lead to dynasties, fed by preferment of ruling parties for ‘their own man’. Perhaps a reduction in numbers of MP’s to say, 500, would lead to significant boundary changes to include a wider cross section of interests and opinions, therefore more representative? Incidentally, it would also lead to the end of gerrymandering and the significant benefit to one party or another as a result of patronage.

rovexCDTi · 9th May 2015, 11:53

UKIP probably arent going anywhere, but i feel that they will slowly modify themselves into a more moderate party. Certainly that's what's happened already, the more unpleasent elements are being removed, the policies are moving more central, and they are dropping the religious nut cases that want fire and brimstone on anyone not white, straight and English.

Their notion that you can restrict or revert social freedom just isnt going to wash, there will be 80s style riots if they try, so I suspect they wont try.

The resignation of Farage will help this because most people ive talked to find him beyond odious.

Their biggest problem will be the EU referendum the Torys have promised. If it happens then UKIP is redundant, whatever the result, at least in the medium term. They will have to rebrand, as the Liberal parties did in the 80s because their main reason to be is gone.

VVC-Geeza · 9th May 2015, 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLYER

Now this funny...

Just heard a political commentator on the radio say that although the Scottish Labour Party are in the phone book it might be better to try to contact them by Ouija board.

There are now more pandas in Scotland than Labour MP's

9th May 2015, 07:35	#74
bikerdude666 Posted a thing or two Jaguar Xe diseasal Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Little Stanion, Corby Posts: 1,922 Thanks: 363 Thanked 390 Times in 241 Posts	I have to say that while PR may seem fairer, I can't see how it would benefit the country. We would end up with continual coalition governments, so still no one would get what they wanted. Things would get done even slower. The system we have is simple, vote tactically on a general election, and vote for the smaller parties for councils etc where it will actually make a difference. Oh and yes god help us having cuts, much better we keep spending money we don't have and getting in more debt. Time to get another credit card, this 1's maxed out…. Last edited by bikerdude666; 9th May 2015 at 08:14..

9th May 2015, 08:15	#76
Gino Gets stuck in Rover 75 Tourer Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Newmarket Posts: 601 Thanks: 384 Thanked 130 Times in 99 Posts	Although PR seems fairer and more democratic, as someone has already said, it would lead to more coalitions and minority governments. As we have had the First Past The Post system we generally, not always!, have stable governments and are less prone to radical parties or revolution. Italy is a good example of weak governments due to repeated coalitions, or Germany before the rise of Hitler. Although we may be forever stuck with the three main parties, I think its not necessarily a bad thing. I think its the local elections where our votes really make a difference. Its just a shame they never seem to have a public presence unless its voting time. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] MODS DONE; plenum spyhole, bonnet cable divider block (previous owner), chrome wing mirror covers, gold fan resistor (previous owner), s/s bumper bolts, uprated under tray fittings silicone intercooler hose, Viton O rings, Crofts door finishers, boot badge, wood dash, Phil-t4's magic wand, wood wheel, mk2 repeaters, HK tweeters & Angel eye projectors.

9th May 2015, 09:19	#78
wraymond This is my second home 75 Auto 2.5 SE Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Westcliff on Sea Posts: 5,205 Thanks: 423 Thanked 1,680 Times in 1,014 Posts	Zero hours contracts are a hedge against vexatious and aggressive claims for wrongful or constructive dismissal by staff against employers. Cameron has stated that there will be a move to abolish Human Rights legislation which should have some effect on this situation. Not too sure about PR, it sounds reasonable but there are problems that follow good intentions throughout politics (the law of unintended consequences). Maybe the problem with FPTP is the size and demarcation of constituencies. They tend to be polarising in political objectives and lead to dynasties, fed by preferment of ruling parties for ‘their own man’. Perhaps a reduction in numbers of MP’s to say, 500, would lead to significant boundary changes to include a wider cross section of interests and opinions, therefore more representative? Incidentally, it would also lead to the end of gerrymandering and the significant benefit to one party or another as a result of patronage. __________________ member no. 235

9th May 2015, 11:53	#79
rovexCDTi This is my second home MG ZT+ 135 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Exeter Posts: 3,626 Thanks: 9 Thanked 42 Times in 26 Posts	UKIP probably arent going anywhere, but i feel that they will slowly modify themselves into a more moderate party. Certainly that's what's happened already, the more unpleasent elements are being removed, the policies are moving more central, and they are dropping the religious nut cases that want fire and brimstone on anyone not white, straight and English. Their notion that you can restrict or revert social freedom just isnt going to wash, there will be 80s style riots if they try, so I suspect they wont try. The resignation of Farage will help this because most people ive talked to find him beyond odious. Their biggest problem will be the EU referendum the Torys have promised. If it happens then UKIP is redundant, whatever the result, at least in the medium term. They will have to rebrand, as the Liberal parties did in the 80s because their main reason to be is gone. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

9th May 2015, 06:46	#72
topman This is my second home MG ZT-T 190 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Lincolnshire Posts: 5,493 Thanks: 372 Thanked 647 Times in 534 Posts	Possibly so. I'm just wary of parties proclaiming it wants x y or z because it's better for democracy, when what they really mean is its better for us. How many would want a system that made them worse off but was more democratic? Not many I'd bet! Nothing personal or aimed at any one party just my general thoughts on the whole PR/AV thing.

9th May 2015, 07:01	#73
Kennyeth This is my second home No more Rover Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Barnsley, South Yorkshire. Posts: 5,881 Thanks: 1,625 Thanked 1,308 Times in 998 Posts	Seeing as a few has put some views and not to political, her`s mine £12 Billion in welfare cuts, God help us! Ken.

9th May 2015, 07:50	#75
topman This is my second home MG ZT-T 190 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Lincolnshire Posts: 5,493 Thanks: 372 Thanked 647 Times in 534 Posts	In fairness that's what people said about the coalition and it lasted 5 years. Many councils work in coalition as do the Scottish and Welsh gov as do many around the world. I can't see any reason it wouldn't work here.

9th May 2015, 08:30	#77
FLYER Banned rover75 cdti AUTO TOURER 160 bhp. Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Glasgow Posts: 35,346 Thanks: 2,985 Thanked 3,685 Times in 2,463 Posts	Now this funny... Just heard a political commentator on the radio say that although the Scottish Labour Party are in the phone book it might be better to try to contact them by Ouija board.