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Old 19th November 2021, 16:48   #81
another_clean_sheet
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i.e. Ask how many have landed up in hospital among those who have avoided infection by personally avoiding groups, wearing masks and meticulously engaging with personal hygiene.

Vacinnated or not vacinated?
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Old 19th November 2021, 17:07   #82
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OK, if you like, insert (mea culpa,) 'only' between 'infected' and 'by'. See how easy it is?
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Old 19th November 2021, 18:34   #83
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Are you kidding? With a history like that of Austria? Non-compliance with the ruling elite is surely 'endemic' with good reason there!

Wrong question? Don't think so. Not unless you compare with 'avoidance of infection by other means' you are majoring on only one (your slanted view of one side only).

i.e. Ask how many have landed up in hospital among those who have avoided infection by personally avoiding all groups, wearing masks and meticulously engaging with personal hygiene. There are a thousand ways of avoidance - else we would be nearly all dead as opposed to a tiny minority of the widely published and vastly misleading official stats.

The biggest deliberate LIE? "Deaths from those with Covid-19 but with other serious illnesses". That figure was widely circulated by HMGOV and various stooges and was total deaths from everything the patients died from and was only withdrawn last week. Gullibility is, or ought to be, a sin.

Now Austria has had to make vaccination compulsory and is considering doing the same, but is suggesting there is likely to be another total lockdown of the population.



Aren't we lucky that so many have accepted voluntary vaccination, despite the nay sayers?
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Old 19th November 2021, 19:19   #84
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Harry, for one at least I do respect the views of others! Because someone offers alternatives it does not refer to the holder of the views! More importantly 'naysayers' usually has negative connotations and if anyone is negative about anything it is certainly not me! The only way I can get a balanced view is to sift all of them, it's invaluable in arriving at an opinion!
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Old 19th November 2021, 19:32   #85
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You have a peculiar idea of what discrimination is - everyone is welcome providing they have had the jabs, or have a valid reason to have not had them. Under 18's are not allowed to order drinks at the bar, if you don't possess a licence, you cannot drive - there are numerous similar things that meet your idea of discrimination. Should we forget the rules and make it a free for all?
"Everyone is welcome providing they have had the jabs" I read that as discrimination, it says to me "Everyone is welcome if they're not Gay, Black, Irish, Jewish" anything but what you want them to be to fit the narrative you are writing about. If the vaccines really are personal choice, and they are, anything that makes the unvaccinated a lesser person in society by any means is totally wrong and needs to be stopped by whatever means. If your vaccine works for you then that's fine by me but it obviously worries you how good it really is, stop trying to force it on others that simply don't want it. I don't care how you live your life, wear a mask and skulk around places like everything and everyone is contagious, it's your life and you can live it as you choose but, don't impose your ideals on everyone because they are not one size fits all. If you want to surrender your remaining life to auditioning for one man and his dog, that's fine with me but I'd rather be the dog.
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Old 19th November 2021, 19:49   #86
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No the figures are there, online to be read and reported. Anyone can make such a report, even you, from which the official figures are derived. What you then do is compare the number who died as a direct result of the jab, versus the number who died of covid, who refused the jab.



It may change which horse you are backing to win..


A month ago, I had several blood samples taken, I had my booster two weeks ago and the flue jab, a pneumonia jab last week, I had my first shingles jab an hour ago - qualms none. Next Wednesday I am due an aranesp jab, in two months I have the second shingles jab due.
My point was only that the main media is shouting the death figures for Covid, but zero reporting any mortality from jabs. It's lopsided. I understand they don't want to put folk off the jab, but vaccine hesitancy comes from not telling the full truth which allows the conspiracy theories to gain traction.
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Old 19th November 2021, 20:14   #87
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Default Discriminate between discrimination types

It is discrimination. However it is not discrimination on the basis of one of the legally protected characteristics e.g. sex, religion, age, disability,...

Whether vaccination status should be one of the protected characteristics is an interesting question.

Something I have been wondering about is whether those who are pro care home workers' employment to be conditional upon being vaccinated would feel the same if the vaccinations were produced by Facebook, Google or Amazon as opposed to pharmaceutical giants. If not, why not?
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Old 19th November 2021, 21:54   #88
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My point was only that the main media is shouting the death figures for Covid, but zero reporting any mortality from jabs. It's lopsided. I understand they don't want to put folk off the jab, but vaccine hesitancy comes from not telling the full truth which allows the conspiracy theories to gain traction.

As there is zero reporting does that mean there are no deaths from a reaction to the vaccinne?
Probably not, but the risk is a lot less than not having the vaccine. Remember how many deaths there were before jabs became widespread? If the death rate from having the jab was similar it would have been reported as you would not be able to hide those sort of numbers.
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Old 19th November 2021, 22:48   #89
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Got to take issue with this "As for the efficacy of the vaccine, the fact that we're all sitting here discussing it shows that it's working exactly as intended, because we're not lying in hospital hooked up to a ventilator!"

How many of us that have been vaccinated have caught the virus since being vaccinated?

macafee2
Take issue with whatever you want! But another_clean_sheet has it right - my point is that the vaccines have played a part in reducing the hospitalisation rate. As I'm sure you're aware, plenty of people have caught the virus since being jabbed (myself included), but if most of that group have suffered zero to mild symptoms, that is a big win not just for the infected people but also for the NHS. And I'm aware that other factors (chiefly, the growing number of people who are immune) have also played a part, but without the vaccines we would currently be in a much worse situation than we are.
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Old 20th November 2021, 08:23   #90
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Take issue with whatever you want! But another_clean_sheet has it right - my point is that the vaccines have played a part in reducing the hospitalisation rate. As I'm sure you're aware, plenty of people have caught the virus since being jabbed (myself included), but if most of that group have suffered zero to mild symptoms, that is a big win not just for the infected people but also for the NHS. And I'm aware that other factors (chiefly, the growing number of people who are immune) have also played a part, but without the vaccines we would currently be in a much worse situation than we are.
I don't disagree but my question still stands.
We don't know how many of us are here due to the covid jab, I for one dont think I have had covid but am double jabbed.

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