Any advice on contesting a speeding fine?

[ukmastiff]

My only advice is , ask to see the evidence by all means before deciding on your plea but don't try anything stupid or dishonest as you could make an unfortunate incident in to something far worse.

Regards

Mas

[steve811]

Originally Posted by raykay

Not quite accurate.


It is only after a 'not guilty' plea is taken at court that the prosecution discloses their evidence, not before a plea.

Not entirely accurate either! The plea does not have to be entered in court, it can be an "indication of plea" to the prosecution. The prosecution then are under a duty to disclose material which might undermine their case or assist the defence. Although the guidlines given by the Atourney General do refer to "when a plea is entered" the general guidance is that prosecutors should be open and transparent and disclose to the accused anything they might rely on in court. Our guidance relfects this, but of course the Police and CPS might have a different interpretation!

http://www.hse.gov.uk/enforce/enforc...disclosure.htm

[raykay]

Originally Posted by steve811

Not entirely accurate either! The plea does not have to be entered in court, it can be an "indication of plea" to the prosecution. The prosecution then are under a duty to disclose material which might undermine their case or assist the defence. Although the guidlines given by the Atourney General do refer to "when a plea is entered" the general guidance is that prosecutors should be open and transparent and disclose to the accused anything they might rely on in court. Our guidance relfects this, but of course the Police and CPS might have a different interpretation!

http://www.hse.gov.uk/enforce/enforc...disclosure.htm

Not guidelines, legislation.

s.1(a), The Criminal Procedure and Investigations Act 1996.

[Yella Fella]

I was sort of in a similar position when a camera 'said' I went through a red light. After a couple of years im still convinced I didnt.

After weighing up the pros and cons of disputing the charge I took the hit, paid a small fine and received the customery 3 points and forgot about it.
It didnt make any difference to my insurance so it had little impact on me.

These things can get nasty and costly if disputed. My advice is to just accept it and move on. You said you are a speed consious and a safe driver so unlkely to be adding additional points on you licence. The 3 points will soon drop off your licence and be forgotten about.

[steve811]

Originally Posted by raykay

Not guidelines, legislation.

s.1(a), The Criminal Procedure and Investigations Act 1996.

True, but then that has been muddied by the requirement to provide initial details of the case under Part 10 of CPR! I think that CPS would be on very shaky ground if served with a request to provide and they failed to comply. I have no idea what the sitaution is like in the frozen north but I know some of our magistrates and DJ's get the hump if the prosecutor refuses to supply information to the defence, especially if requested early enough!

[SirRustalot]

Thanks for all your inputs.

I don't rely on my satnav as a speed indicator - it just has the usual flashing warning of cameras that such devices exhibit. I just looked at the trip diagnostics on my satnav and it said max speed 68 mph. I haven't used it since that particular trip since I was heading for somehwere beyond Aberdeen at that time and I wasn't sure where it was. Now I knowwhere it is, I've had no use for the satnav since. In addition, to be clear, I'm confident that I didn't speed through the 50mph camera because:

I know this road and, particularly, this stretch with the 50mph camera. I pass it nearly every single day and am conditioned into ducking well below the limit while passing it.

I'm genererally not in any hurry since I always plan and leave earlier than required.

I know myself and my habits very well. I will almost certainly have slowed right down to below the 50mph limit.

I was laden with luggage and, hence, will have been doddling along the road.


And for the holier-than-thou folks who say 'well don't speed in the first place', this is the whole point of the post - I'm absolutely convinced I wasn't because I generally don't. I say generally since, in times when I've been over the limit it's usually in the middle of nowhere, on my bike and even then only a few miles-per-hour over and perfectly safe. I am an Advanced rider, by the way. Thus, I think this is a mistake with the camera or there are other influences that triggered it in which I'm not prepared to pay good money for and get points over.

As for just paying it and moving on, that's what the system relies on and I'm not playing on this occasion. I'm absolutely the worst person to tick off if I feel an injustice 'cos I'll grab it and shake it like an angry dog until something breaks.

And as for the camera never lies, well, it does from time to time and I will be seeking proof that it was in certifiable use at that time. Due to its remoteness, I doubt it.

[mystabe]

Can you prove you weren't speeding? that will be the problem I'm no angel so I'm not knocking you but I suspect that is where you're going to have a problem.

Worth a try I guess but to be honest I'd cough up the fine, take the points and move on UNLESS I had any kind of proof I wasn't speeding or any proof of issues with the camera otherwise it may well end up costing you

I do wish you luck if you decide to fight it though, those camera's positioned solely to make money need to be gone

[milleplod]

Just realised I posted about LTI 20/20 earlier....I assumed you were caught by a camera van for some reason! Having re-read the post, I think you were caught by a GATSO or similar, so my apologies if that's the case. Its because I'm old.....

Pete

[raykay]

Originally Posted by steve811

True, but then that has been muddied by the requirement to provide initial details of the case under Part 10 of CPR! I think that CPS would be on very shaky ground if served with a request to provide and they failed to comply. I have no idea what the sitaution is like in the frozen north but I know some of our magistrates and DJ's get the hump if the prosecutor refuses to supply information to the defence, especially if requested early enough!

CPR part 10 only requires initial details do be disclosed, not necessarily the evidence.
In traffic cases, the required details will usually be in the initial paperwork, eg. for speeding it will normally show the speed alleged, limit, method of detection etc.

[James.uk]

>>>It is only after a 'not guilty' plea is taken at court that the prosecution discloses their evidence, not before a plea.<<<

This is a con, challenge it. When they told me that, after I requested full disclosure in a speeding case, I wrote and told them "if that be the case, then I shall ask for a postponement of the hearing in order to prepare a defence based on any new information produced, I will also be claiming for any costs involved in acquiring said information". - - - --- I never heard from them again????????? that was six years ago..

The above was when defending myself against an allegation of breaking the speed limit laid against me, the allegation came from a "safety" camera Co, NOT the police..

***I was photographed passing a fixed speed camera at 4am on a Sunday morning. The camera was outside an ex school that had been knocked down 12 months earlier!!!!! So it was alongside a proposed shopping centre. In actuality, an empty field at the time. .
...