Is a B&D Simple Start safe to use?

[Steve916]

Anybody looked into trying the Tesla switch. Looks like a good experiment to set up sometime. Almost perpetual charging
http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by SD1too

Herman,

There are many occasions where Ohm's law doesn't apply, and charging batteries is one of them. I'm surprised that this wasn't covered in your degree course.

Place an ammeter between two batteries with a voltage differential of 0.03v and please post a photograph of the current flowing between them.

Simon

Correct!

He simply does not understand the even the basic behavior pattern of batteries. Please Herman you are driving us nuts, please go away and at least try to understand the how batteries behave. Comparisons to buckets and water simply do not hack it and Ohms Law cannot be applied in the way you seem to imagine.

[HarryM1BYT]

Originally Posted by VMax1000

I did, because it's a DC circuit so most elements behave like a resistor (or can be treated like one)

But as you brought up the 'not purely resistive', I assumed -rightly or wrongly- that you were referring to a battery as a large capacitor.

You cannot treat a battery as a resistor. It is somewhat more akin to a capacitor, but even a capacitor does not fit either - because it is a battery with vastly different properties.

[VMax1000]

Originally Posted by HarryM1BYT

You cannot treat a battery as a resistor. It is somewhat more akin to a capacitor, but even a capacitor does not fit either - because it is a battery with vastly different properties.

Here you go



##Rm is the resistance of the metallic path through the cell including the terminals, electrodes and inter-connections.
##Ra is the resistance of the electrochemical path including the electrolyte and the separator.
##Cb is the capacitance of the parallel plates which form the electrodes of the cell.
##Ri is the non-linear contact resistance between the plate or electrode and the electrolyte.

[VMax1000]

Originally Posted by HarryM1BYT

Correct!

He simply does not understand the even the basic behavior pattern of batteries. Please Herman you are driving us nuts, please go away and at least try to understand the how batteries behave. Comparisons to buckets and water simply do not hack it and Ohms Law cannot be applied in the way you seem to imagine.

Harry, rather than posting replies without any backup or evidence, can you please explain to all the interested readers how a battery behaves?

I can't remember it was me who started the bucket discussion but hey ho

And also would like to be enlightened what is there to understand about ohms law that I seem to apply wrongly.

As long as there is a Voltage difference and a resistance a current will flow

So rather than making all the long replies trying to convince the non-educated they are wrong by the amount of words and quotes in red you seem to use, please post a constructive reply with the facts you base your statements on and I'll leave you alone.

[Supervinnie40]

Well, I kinda lost the basic point each party is trying to make, and I kinda think each party has long lost the point they are trying to make.

But we have found out, that the battery-booster (my device) does work. If the battery is just to low to turn over the engine (but not completely empty), this device will give it a bit of 'boost' that will allow to turn over the engine. As soon as the engine is running, you should be fine (hopefully).
So, the device works.

I'll try to think of something that will allow me to measure the voltage when the device is actually being used. Then we might disclose how 'safe' it is.

[VMax1000]

Originally Posted by Supervinnie40

Well, I kinda lost the basic point each party is trying to make, and I kinda think each party has long lost the point they are trying to make.

But we have found out, that the battery-booster (my device) does work. If the battery is just to low to turn over the engine (but not completely empty), this device will give it a bit of 'boost' that will allow to turn over the engine. As soon as the engine is running, you should be fine (hopefully).
So, the device works.

I'll try to think of something that will allow me to measure the voltage when the device is actually being used. Then we might disclose how 'safe' it is.

Amazing, it works.

Didn't think it would as I almost was convinced by the higher authorities you can't charge or boost a battery with another battery.

Must be the 18V out of the 3 x 6V batteries that's done the trick as it can't be the tiny amount of energy stored in them.

I also learned in this thread that Voltage can be transferred without any current flowing....how amazing is that.



Maybe you've just been lucky and your battery just needed a tickle

[Alan_G]

Originally Posted by Supervinnie40

Well, I kinda lost the basic point each party is trying to make, and I kinda think each party has long lost the point they are trying to make.

But we have found out, that the battery-booster (my device) does work. If the battery is just to low to turn over the engine (but not completely empty), this device will give it a bit of 'boost' that will allow to turn over the engine. As soon as the engine is running, you should be fine (hopefully).
So, the device works.

I'll try to think of something that will allow me to measure the voltage when the device is actually being used. Then we might disclose how 'safe' it is.

I got bored/lost reading most of it (I am an electrical dunce), but glad to hear it works.

[Polly]

Originally Posted by VMax1000

I think arguing is not the correct term.

It's more a discussion for the benefit of others.



As for having no idea of the qualifications of others.....that's debatable as well.



Sometimes you have to take things with a pinch of salt but as always on a rather large community.....it's a mix of people.



We all make mistakes or wrong assumptions, myself included, but if it sparks an exchange of ideas............great.



I don't have to be right, close will do



As one of my managers always said, no problem is that big, a cup of tea can't solve it. I'm going to get one now.

Discussion for the benefit of others???
I'm new to this forum, but I did not find the above discussion helpfully, entertaining maybe, but decidedly unhelpful. The problem is that the op did not get a helpfull answer to the question.
I'm no expert, but I do have an understanding of electronics, and two important points have not been mentioned.
1: you should attempt to start a modern car with a low battery, in doing so you run the risk of scrambling the engine management computer by producing voltages that it simply does not understand.
2: the actual question, I don't believe such a device would work, it's use will be limited at best. if the output voltage is 12v it will do harm in itself, but see 1 above. On the other hand if the output is 18v as suggested, that is the maximum design voltage for many electronic devices. Perhaps the resistance of any connections might ensure the full18v would not reach the processors, but you should consider this before using the device
Les

[VMax1000]

Originally Posted by Polly

Discussion for the benefit of others???
I'm new to this forum, but I did not find the above discussion helpfully, entertaining maybe, but decidedly unhelpful. The problem is that the op did not get a helpfull answer to the question.
I'm no expert, but I do have an understanding of electronics, and two important points have not been mentioned.
1: you should attempt to start a modern car with a low battery, in doing so you run the risk of scrambling the engine management computer by producing voltages that it simply does not understand.
2: the actual question, I don't believe such a device would work, it's use will be limited at best. if the output voltage is 12v it will do harm in itself, but see 1 above. On the other hand if the output is 18v as suggested, that is the maximum design voltage for many electronic devices. Perhaps the resistance of any connections might ensure the full18v would not reach the processors, but you should consider this before using the deviceLes

OP just posted it did work