Using the Hard Shoulder, Utter Madness? - Page 2

JohnDotCom · 7th October 2007, 13:40

Some very good points there David,
but as an ex HATO you will know how difficult it can be to get on scene at a serious RTA.
The opening of the Hard Shoulder to vehicles and thus blocking emergency Vehicles will mean slowing right down and weaving in between stationary vehicles, I think IMHO is a backward step.
The promised "lay-bye's have already been lengthened from the Original plan and will not be in place on suggested roll out.

Greeners · 7th October 2007, 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnDotCom

Some very good points there David,
but as an ex HATO you will know how difficult it can be to get on scene at a serious RTA.
The opening of the Hard Shoulder to vehicles and thus blocking emergency Vehicles will mean slowing right down and weaving in between stationary vehicles, I think IMHO is a backward step.
The promised "lay-bye's have already been lengthened from the Original plan and will not be in place on suggested roll out.

John

Couldn't agree more, used to drive me mad when people pulled off the carriageway onto the HS, and personally I think it's all bonkers.

If they spent the time and money bringing driving standards up, you probably wouldn't need extra roadspace.

BigRuss · 8th October 2007, 01:13

It was difficult enough getting to the scene of an incident without this!
It is probably the worst idea I've heard. How many lives lost or serious injuries is this going to cause.
The hard shoulder was put there for good reasons.
For goodness sake people can't even use peak/off peak bus lanes properly, never mind motorway lanes.
I'm not sure people who break down will be able to find their way into these lay-bys. If you have a serious mechanical failure in the outside lane, it can be difficult enough to get across onto a continuous hard shoulder, never mind a much smaller lay-by.

Russ

lightpainter · 8th October 2007, 15:45

As an ex white van man it sounds like a good idea to me, even better to stop bunching and slow traffic would be to allow over and undertaking in any lane, it works in the USA, have never understood why we don’t adopt it over here?

Keith · 8th October 2007, 16:06

On the assumption everything has ground to a halt following any incident would the emergency services simply come up the motorway from the opposite direction against the flow of traffic?

I am sure that has been considered as in my opinion road planners especially those that put traffic lights on roundabout are the most intelligent people on the planet!

Keith · 8th October 2007, 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tootall

The M42 has a section which uses the hardshoulder at peak times to help traffic flow, it does work but you do need to your eyes everywhere .

Absolutely agree I found the experience very odd having to keep switching lanes every few hundred yards!

BigRuss · 10th October 2007, 01:56

I found this, may be of interest:
http://www.publications.parliament.u...cc/134/134.pdf

Dated 2004-5 but gives the pro's and cons and objections at that time, bit long winded but worth a look if you've got some spare time. It compares both the schemes in the Netherlands, and the U.S.

note:
Over 200 people a year are killed on the hard shoulder of U.K. motorways (I'm very concerned that this figure could rise due to this change).

Sorry Keith, but as far as I'm aware, the exemptions under the road traffic acts would not cover an emergency vehicle, going the wrong way on a motorway.(It certainly doesn't cover one-way streets)

Russ

View Poll Results: Is it safe and would you use it?
This is to Scary for words.	5	22.73%
Utter Madness, I wouldn't use it.	11	50.00%
Sensible but I wouldn't use it.	0	0%
Sensible I would use it.	5	22.73%
A Great Idea, can't wait.	0	0%
No feelings one way or the other	1	4.55%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

8th October 2007, 15:45	#14
lightpainter Posted a thing or two 2004 Rover 75 Saloon 2.5 V6 Conn SE Auto Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Rainham, Kent. Garden of England Posts: 1,162 Thanks: 28 Thanked 42 Times in 6 Posts	As an ex white van man it sounds like a good idea to me, even better to stop bunching and slow traffic would be to allow over and undertaking in any lane, it works in the USA, have never understood why we don’t adopt it over here? __________________ See my pictures here. My Flickr [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

7th October 2007, 13:40	#11
JohnDotCom * Rover 75 FaceLift Tourer CDTi 170BHP Auto ConnSE 2005 Model Starlight Silver Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Abergele Posts: 28,735 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Some very good points there David, but as an ex HATO you will know how difficult it can be to get on scene at a serious RTA. The opening of the Hard Shoulder to vehicles and thus blocking emergency Vehicles will mean slowing right down and weaving in between stationary vehicles, I think IMHO is a backward step. The promised "lay-bye's have already been lengthened from the Original plan and will not be in place on suggested roll out.

8th October 2007, 01:13	#13
BigRuss Premium Trader 75 CDT Tourer,2.5 Launch Saloon, Omipro MG/Rover (T4) Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Liversedge, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,419 Thanks: 1,105 Thanked 1,340 Times in 661 Posts	It was difficult enough getting to the scene of an incident without this! It is probably the worst idea I've heard. How many lives lost or serious injuries is this going to cause. The hard shoulder was put there for good reasons. For goodness sake people can't even use peak/off peak bus lanes properly, never mind motorway lanes. I'm not sure people who break down will be able to find their way into these lay-bys. If you have a serious mechanical failure in the outside lane, it can be difficult enough to get across onto a continuous hard shoulder, never mind a much smaller lay-by. Russ

8th October 2007, 16:06	#15
Keith This is my second home ZT400 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Ellesmere Posts: 5,948 Thanks: 0 Thanked 43 Times in 29 Posts	On the assumption everything has ground to a halt following any incident would the emergency services simply come up the motorway from the opposite direction against the flow of traffic? I am sure that has been considered as in my opinion road planners especially those that put traffic lights on roundabout are the most intelligent people on the planet!

10th October 2007, 01:56	#17
BigRuss Premium Trader 75 CDT Tourer,2.5 Launch Saloon, Omipro MG/Rover (T4) Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Liversedge, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,419 Thanks: 1,105 Thanked 1,340 Times in 661 Posts	I found this, may be of interest: http://www.publications.parliament.u...cc/134/134.pdf Dated 2004-5 but gives the pro's and cons and objections at that time, bit long winded but worth a look if you've got some spare time. It compares both the schemes in the Netherlands, and the U.S. note: Over 200 people a year are killed on the hard shoulder of U.K. motorways (I'm very concerned that this figure could rise due to this change). Sorry Keith, but as far as I'm aware, the exemptions under the road traffic acts would not cover an emergency vehicle, going the wrong way on a motorway.(It certainly doesn't cover one-way streets) Russ