Speaker Upgrade - Page 2

coolcat · 27th July 2013, 11:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by trimani

Thanks Guys

So it would seem that component speakers are a better option than the 6 1/2 inch Harmon Kardon.

I also see a good recommendation for the Harmon Kardon tweeters, especially if fitted front & back.

If that is the case would it be a good idea to fit mains as components & use Harmon Kardon tweeters ? I do like the idea of the tweeters making it look OE.

So, Component speakers. What make, & how much (funds are very tight).

If I use component speakers do I have to start modifying fittings. I cant do that. Anything I do has got to be more or less plug & play !

Thanks for all the replies.

trimani (Alf)

PS I've realised this should be in ICE . Sorry, I expect it to be moved.

Hi Alf,
I have various component speakers in stock should you wish to check my trader shop out

http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=150791
You will however have to take the door cards off to fit these ( as you will if you fit the HK system as well ) so not quite plug and play whichever route you go down.
Most component speakers come with a crossover that will need to be installed in the door card as well.
What you have is basically the speaker wires from the head unit ( already in situ) connect to the crossover first then the crossover feeds the bass /mids and tweeters ( wire is already there ) separately.
The speakers can mount straight into the existing door pods if you want to keep installation simple.
Then it's switch on, test and finally replace door cards

arodriguez · 27th July 2013, 13:29

Alf,

The components, as Jeff has indicated, come as a bass unit and a tweeter fed from a crossover which you can tie up in the door. You won't need to bother with any HK items at all. The tweeters should fit nicely in the existing door cards so once back together it will all look totally standard. Its worth putting the standard tweeters you remove into the rear doors to bring the sound up.

Regards

Tony

US Spec · 27th July 2013, 13:37

with regards to power ratings..look at the obvious..find a name brand 50x4 amplifier and compare the size with a 50x4 head unit (even double din) how did they fit it in there along with a tuner, cd mech, and all the other components? radio outputs are rated power from "mosfets" and do not work as a "normal" amp would do.
while I agree that speakers are a fine upgrade and component speakers from companies such as alpine, pioneer, clarion, mb quart and others are very good....sound quality is found in power first. a better powered system will sound far better than one only powered by the head unit. it doesnt have to "shake" the car it just has to sound good!

trimani · 27th July 2013, 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolcat

Hi Alf,
I have various component speakers in stock should you wish to check my trader shop out

http://www.the75andztclub.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=150791
You will however have to take the door cards off to fit these ( as you will if you fit the HK system as well ) so not quite plug and play whichever route you go down.
Most component speakers come with a crossover that will need to be installed in the door card as well.
What you have is basically the speaker wires from the head unit ( already in situ) connect to the crossover first then the crossover feeds the bass /mids and tweeters ( wire is already there ) separately.
The speakers can mount straight into the existing door pods if you want to keep installation simple.
Then it's switch on, test and finally replace door cards

Hi Jeff

Thanks for interesting post

Basically I am after improving the standard sound. I don't want ear splitting, head thumping, car shaking, everybody knows I'm coming system !

What I do want is improved audio output over the basic system. Especially as I have now got my DD Unit.

I can manage door card removal, and straight forward wiring. What I can't do is start to modify speaker/door fixings, or removing to much trim.

Do I need to change tweeters, and do I need an amp ? On the amp front, if it would improve system can i fit at later date. What about a subwoofer. Is it a improvement, and if so could I use Rover OE under the parcel shelf jobbie ?

With that little lot in mind could you suggest a kit, with neccessry wiring and connectors. Price will have a big bearing on my decision.

Whilst here, I would like to thank you for the amount of help you gave me with my DD. Without yours & Seans help I would be still sat here with a bunch of wires & bananas.

Cheers

trimani (Alf)

Howie666 · 27th July 2013, 16:56

Fitting the MGR tweeters in the rear door cards really improved the overall sound if you don't have them already. They slot straight into the holders. I'm tempted by component speakers but like you I don't want to dismantle anything serious to install them!

Dragrad · 27th July 2013, 23:00

Thread moved to appropriate forum. Re-direct left in old

coolcat · 28th July 2013, 06:41

Hi Alf and Dale,

Yes you can still use the original tweeters although as others have said, better ones will come with the new components.
As previously mentioned you could then use the oem tweeters and put them in the rear.
No you don't have to have an amp but you could add one later and improve the sound still further should you wish.
The component bass/mid units will be a straight swap size wise for the oem speakers so no modification of door fitting needed.
What you will need to do is a slight bit of wiring !
The plug that goes into the oem speaker will need to be chopped off and the wires fed into the crossover box ( about the size of a pack of playing cards ) and then fed to the speakers.
What that means is the speaker wires go to the crossover first then onto the bass/mid and the tweeters

The crossovers will need to be mounted somewhere in the door card being careful not to let them fowl any of the door mech and window mech parts.
Usually they are held on with adhesive pads or Velcro pads that are supplied.
Repeat the same for both doors or all four if you intend to replace the rears as well.
Most people just replace the fronts and then maybe upgrade the rears to full range units and re use the tweeters removed from the fronts

A subwoofer is subjective and in my opinion the Harman Kardon under shelf or rear panel tourer sub really don't add an awful lot of low end frequency to bother with them.
To get meaningful bass requires a larger enclosure with a large(ish) driver and powerful amplification.
I don't think you will need one Alf unless you have a love of drum and bass music and like shaking your booty

So all you will need would be the component speakers, they all come with extra speaker wire and all screws etc for mounting.
£60.00 would buy you a pair of reasonable components which would offer an improvement on stock and would out perform the HK speakers as well.
If you decided on a rear pair of full range speakers as well, a starting price would be around £30.00 to £40.00.
Of course you can spend plenty more money and reap greater benefits but then you are entering the world of amplification, door card anti resonant treatment, upgraded speaker wires etc...
Read into that more time and more work on the fitting!
Hope that helps Alf.
If you want to discuss this further please feel free to ring me at the shop or my mobile.
Not today though as I'll be at the Halfway House meeting with my hands buried in dashboards

Howie666 · 28th July 2013, 19:05

Thank you Jeff, much food for thought there! The n/s door card has to come off again to replace the window trim with aluminium rot, so while I'm ripping my beloved apart again

it might be a good time to make sounds better too...

trimani · 28th July 2013, 20:02

Hi Jeff

What a wealth of information you are, thank you.

Taking your advice, I think I will go for the front and back speaker option straight away.

For your info I already have tweeters fitted front and back, but understand yours are better quality, so that's fine. I read recently of a guy who stuck the front off of Harmon Kardon tweeters to make the look OEM ! Worth considering !

From your very plain instructions I think I could manage the installation OK.

I understand your comments on the parcel shelf sub woofer not worth worrying about.

Next is the question of AMP. I think I will get one straight away, and get all work out of the way in one go.

Thanks again Jeff, and I am sending you a PM.

Cheers

trimani (Alf)

coolcat · 28th July 2013, 21:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howie666

Thank you Jeff, much food for thought there! The n/s door card has to come off again to replace the window trim with aluminium rot, so while I'm ripping my beloved apart again

it might be a good time to make sounds better too...

That would make perfect sense to do the upgrade then

27th July 2013, 16:56	#15
Howie666 I really should get out more....... MG ZT 190+, Trophy Blue Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Preston Posts: 2,067 Thanks: 1,401 Thanked 309 Times in 195 Posts	Fitting the MGR tweeters in the rear door cards really improved the overall sound if you don't have them already. They slot straight into the holders. I'm tempted by component speakers but like you I don't want to dismantle anything serious to install them! __________________ Commission Number 352 To do list: 1. Reversing sensors 1a. Headlights polished - DONE! (Magic Mike ) 2. Auto dip rear view mirror 3. Seats replaced - DONE! (thank you Mischief) 7. Bodywork repainted 8. Inlet manifold changed for a working one - DONE! (Magic Mike )

27th July 2013, 23:00	#16
Dragrad This is my second home *None DROWNED** Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Cardigan Posts: 33,339 Thanks: 1,257 Thanked 1,664 Times in 1,081 Posts	Thread moved to appropriate forum. Re-direct left in old __________________ Andrew Ich Dien Problem solving is... lateral thinking SEARCH FIRST ...ASK LATER...

28th July 2013, 06:41	#17
coolcat This is my second home Audi Q3 TDI S-Line Quattro Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Clacton On Sea/On the boat somewhere Posts: 51,225 Thanks: 9,890 Thanked 12,235 Times in 8,232 Posts	Hi Alf and Dale, Yes you can still use the original tweeters although as others have said, better ones will come with the new components. As previously mentioned you could then use the oem tweeters and put them in the rear. No you don't have to have an amp but you could add one later and improve the sound still further should you wish. The component bass/mid units will be a straight swap size wise for the oem speakers so no modification of door fitting needed. What you will need to do is a slight bit of wiring ! The plug that goes into the oem speaker will need to be chopped off and the wires fed into the crossover box ( about the size of a pack of playing cards ) and then fed to the speakers. What that means is the speaker wires go to the crossover first then onto the bass/mid and the tweeters The crossovers will need to be mounted somewhere in the door card being careful not to let them fowl any of the door mech and window mech parts. Usually they are held on with adhesive pads or Velcro pads that are supplied. Repeat the same for both doors or all four if you intend to replace the rears as well. Most people just replace the fronts and then maybe upgrade the rears to full range units and re use the tweeters removed from the fronts A subwoofer is subjective and in my opinion the Harman Kardon under shelf or rear panel tourer sub really don't add an awful lot of low end frequency to bother with them. To get meaningful bass requires a larger enclosure with a large(ish) driver and powerful amplification. I don't think you will need one Alf unless you have a love of drum and bass music and like shaking your booty So all you will need would be the component speakers, they all come with extra speaker wire and all screws etc for mounting. £60.00 would buy you a pair of reasonable components which would offer an improvement on stock and would out perform the HK speakers as well. If you decided on a rear pair of full range speakers as well, a starting price would be around £30.00 to £40.00. Of course you can spend plenty more money and reap greater benefits but then you are entering the world of amplification, door card anti resonant treatment, upgraded speaker wires etc... Read into that more time and more work on the fitting! Hope that helps Alf. If you want to discuss this further please feel free to ring me at the shop or my mobile. Not today though as I'll be at the Halfway House meeting with my hands buried in dashboards __________________ Jeff. Last edited by coolcat; 28th July 2013 at 06:47..

28th July 2013, 19:05	#18
Howie666 I really should get out more....... MG ZT 190+, Trophy Blue Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Preston Posts: 2,067 Thanks: 1,401 Thanked 309 Times in 195 Posts	Thank you Jeff, much food for thought there! The n/s door card has to come off again to replace the window trim with aluminium rot, so while I'm ripping my beloved apart again it might be a good time to make sounds better too... __________________ Commission Number 352 To do list: 1. Reversing sensors 1a. Headlights polished - DONE! (Magic Mike ) 2. Auto dip rear view mirror 3. Seats replaced - DONE! (thank you Mischief) 7. Bodywork repainted 8. Inlet manifold changed for a working one - DONE! (Magic Mike )

27th July 2013, 13:29	#12
arodriguez Loves to post Rover 75 Club 1.8T SE Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Bristol Posts: 310 Thanks: 28 Thanked 35 Times in 32 Posts	Alf, The components, as Jeff has indicated, come as a bass unit and a tweeter fed from a crossover which you can tie up in the door. You won't need to bother with any HK items at all. The tweeters should fit nicely in the existing door cards so once back together it will all look totally standard. Its worth putting the standard tweeters you remove into the rear doors to bring the sound up. Regards Tony

27th July 2013, 13:37	#13
US Spec Newbie rover 75 club 1.8, rover 75 2.5 kv6 auto conn Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Stoke on Trent Posts: 16 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	with regards to power ratings..look at the obvious..find a name brand 50x4 amplifier and compare the size with a 50x4 head unit (even double din) how did they fit it in there along with a tuner, cd mech, and all the other components? radio outputs are rated power from "mosfets" and do not work as a "normal" amp would do. while I agree that speakers are a fine upgrade and component speakers from companies such as alpine, pioneer, clarion, mb quart and others are very good....sound quality is found in power first. a better powered system will sound far better than one only powered by the head unit. it doesnt have to "shake" the car it just has to sound good!

28th July 2013, 20:02	#19
trimani Passed Away ROVER 75 V6 2Ltr 2001 AUTO / EMERALD MOTORBILITY SCOOTER Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Poole Quay Posts: 3,180 Thanks: 2,051 Thanked 570 Times in 311 Posts	Hi Jeff What a wealth of information you are, thank you. Taking your advice, I think I will go for the front and back speaker option straight away. For your info I already have tweeters fitted front and back, but understand yours are better quality, so that's fine. I read recently of a guy who stuck the front off of Harmon Kardon tweeters to make the look OEM ! Worth considering ! From your very plain instructions I think I could manage the installation OK. I understand your comments on the parcel shelf sub woofer not worth worrying about. Next is the question of AMP. I think I will get one straight away, and get all work out of the way in one go. Thanks again Jeff, and I am sending you a PM. Cheers trimani (Alf)