Starting Issue

[JHB]

Hi all, hope somebody can help me out on this.

My Rover 75 2.0 auto Con Se CDT Mk1 Tourer 2003 was left for three weeks and then would not turnover. At first I suspected the key had become out of sync but the usual play around produced no results. Battery seems fine. No warning engine lights on the dash and the key fobs open and close as they should. With key in position 2, I was able to start the engine by removing the starter lucar and hard wiring to battery positive temporarily which seems to discount an immobiliser problem. Traced back the starter feed (black) wire to the ECU box in the plenum which is fine. However, from the red/white wire onwards towards the immobiliser EWS and on to the ignition switch there is a break. The starter switch indicates there is connection when in position 3. Incidentally, can I find a wiring diagram for a Project Dive Hard Wired fuse box -no way - I'm looking to be proved wrong though!).

So far I haven't attempted to take out the EWS immobiliser but all looks dry, as was the plenum. Before I start this task, I thought I should seek advice in case it is a sensor somewhere causing the problem. The car has 100k on the clock.

Any help welcome.

[agw_01]

I've just had some fun with this on my 03 ZT which with weeks of intermittent issues, including replacing the starter motor, were all down to a rather soggy EWS with corroded PCB components.

From what I can gather from poking about, the red/white cable out of the ignition switch carries 12v on cranking to the EWS. This comes out of the EWS on another red/white wire that connects to the inhibitor switch on the gearbox. From here, this runs to the starter solenoid.

First thing I'd be checking is the voltage you have at the solenoid wire during cranking. If it's 8v, look directly at the EWS as being at fault.

[SD1too]

Originally Posted by JHB

Battery seems fine.

What does “seems” mean John? Have you measured its voltage at all positions of the ignition switch?
In this cold weather and after leaving your car unused for three weeks the battery is the prime suspect. The first thing you should do is charge it using mains powered equipment, preferably a ‘smart’ charger, for at least 24 hours.

Simon

[COLVERT]

Originally Posted by SD1too

What does “seems” mean John? Have you measured its voltage at all positions of the ignition switch?
In this cold weather and after leaving your car unused for three weeks the battery is the prime suspect. The first thing you should do is charge it using mains powered equipment, preferably a ‘smart’ charger, for at least 24 hours.

Simon

Though he did mention, Simon, that the engine started OK using a by-pass wire to the starter motor.

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by JHB

Hi all, hope somebody can help me out on this.

My Rover 75 2.0 auto Con Se CDT Mk1 Tourer 2003 was left for three weeks and then would not turnover. At first I suspected the key had become out of sync but the usual play around produced no results. Battery seems fine. No warning engine lights on the dash and the key fobs open and close as they should. With key in position 2, I was able to start the engine by removing the starter lucar and hard wiring to battery positive temporarily which seems to discount an immobiliser problem. Traced back the starter feed (black) wire to the ECU box in the plenum which is fine. However, from the red/white wire onwards towards the immobiliser EWS and on to the ignition switch there is a break. The starter switch indicates there is connection when in position 3. Incidentally, can I find a wiring diagram for a Project Dive Hard Wired fuse box -no way - I'm looking to be proved wrong though!).




So far I haven't attempted to take out the EWS immobiliser but all looks dry, as was the plenum. Before I start this task, I thought I should seek advice in case it is a sensor somewhere causing the problem. The car has 100k on the clock.

Any help welcome.

The EWS may well be damaged, does your car have a sunroof?

Anyway the modus operandi of the EWS in an automatic diesel is as follows....

If the following criteria are present correct the crank signal will be enabled

The transponder in the key transmits a valid encoded data packet to the EWS3

The gear selection signal from the EAT ecu shows either P or N selected

So you have determined the key transponder is sending a valid signal to the EWS or the car would not start even when hotwiring the starter, this leaves the possibility of the signal from the gearbox ECU being incorrect, or an internal failure of the EWS, more common than you might imagine.

Brian

[JHB]

Thanks to agw01 and to Simon, the starter lead was volt tested with ignition switch on with a zero result and the battery was charged overnight a couple of times. The fact that I can start the car without problem by using a jump between starter solenoid to battery would indicate to me that the battery is not the issue. The auto inhibitor switch needs to be investigated once snow has cleared. I haven't yet volt tested the ignition switch rather I unplugged the battery leads and used a multimeter to test continuity. There wasn't anything untoward.

Still scratching my head on what the problem might be.

[JHB]

Useful info, Brian, the car does not have a sunroof and a drain pipe to cause havoc. I will let all know how I get on but it won't be until the weekend at the earliest.

John

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by JHB

Thanks to agw01 and to Simon, the starter lead was volt tested with ignition switch on with a zero result and the battery was charged overnight a couple of times. The fact that I can start the car without problem by using a jump between starter solenoid to battery would indicate to me that the battery is not the issue. The auto inhibitor switch needs to be investigated once snow has cleared. I haven't yet volt tested the ignition switch rather I unplugged the battery leads and used a multimeter to test continuity. There wasn't anything untoward.

Still scratching my head on what the problem might be.

The auto inhibitor switch can be tested simply, as it feeds 12V into pin 6 of the EWS


My money is on a defective EWS3 unit rather than an inhibit switch problem


Brian

[JHB]

Just to conclude, I put the car into the local T4 garage who diagnosed a water damaged EWS3, trigger wire solenoid within was giving a poor reading. Anyway, new part was ordered and car is ready for collection tomorrow - snow permitting! When I inspected the immobiliser it didn't have signs of damp. The offside drain pipe next to the plenum seems to have been the culprit. On reflection only clue to any dampness was the push fit clip of the lower panel attached to the shell which was rusty.

Hopefully, a happy ending.

John

[marinabrian]

Originally Posted by JHB

Just to conclude, I put the car into the local T4 garage who diagnosed a water damaged EWS3, trigger wire solenoid within was giving a poor reading. Anyway, new part was ordered and car is ready for collection tomorrow - snow permitting! When I inspected the immobiliser it didn't have signs of damp. The offside drain pipe next to the plenum seems to have been the culprit. On reflection only clue to any dampness was the push fit clip of the lower panel attached to the shell which was rusty.

Hopefully, a happy ending.

John

As I suspected, and I could have supplied a replacement EWS coded for £65

Brian