Greta Thunberg
 

Setting aside that there could be a lot of "manipulation" going on here, a powerful and moving speech!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pQiCew4P34


Look out world, you are being watched by the kids.

I still wonder how many of the generation us oldies are destroying will still want the latest electronic gizmos this Christmas regardless of the pollution their manufacturing creates ?

Climate change is all down to motorinf and air travel, nothing else. Lets as a government tax the motorists, haulage companies and bus operators to the hilt. Along with anyone daring to travel abroad.:mad:

On the underlying topic the statistics are far from credible and are based on the negative viewpoints of commentators who see themselves as saviours.

Targets for any remedy are nations - not individuals - and they will not change to any meaningful degree, nor even listen.

On the performance of the speaker in support of radical change it was a moving and impressive delivery. If her words were her own she is a present and future field leader but I suspect her youth and passion has been harnessed by her elders. Even so, a remarkable and creditworthy performance.

I was more worried than impressed and not about the weather ... it is honking down here atm. It did not look or sound at all normal to me and I could not help but feel that if anything has been stolen from her then it is definitely her childhood and not her dreams. But as for who was responsible for the theft I would not place money on social services blaming the rest of the world. :eek: :getmecoat:

Around 1/4 of all global warming gases are from China, now the workshop of the world, just like we used to be at the start of the Industrial Revolution.

We can only hope to set an example, whatever we (UK) do will not make much difference overall.

Expectation of an ever expanding economy, production and trade works against the principle of a sustainable future.Too many products too many people.

Quite an interesting read on the one.org website, very thought provoking

Have to take your word for it Simon. My 'content control settings' decline to give me access to it. It must be subversive, contain rude stuff, or carry ads for heaven knows what.

we gave ye geldof can we give bono to please ;)
but we share rory :}

Just found a chart that gives CO2 emissions by country, China was 27.4% and the UK stands at 1.1%.

Strange there were no climate change protests in China. :shrug:

For those who don't use IMDB the page for Greta Thurnberg has her as a voice actress (once) for a short film under production.
As herself 17 times on such things as ITN and Good Morning Britain. Archive footage 9 times again on Good Morning Britain and such like.
The Miscellaneous Crew 'representing' her refer again to ITN.

There are two quotes given, one from her recent UN speech and another one about educating politicians. I don't know ( or care ) who produces IMDB but I would imagine more quotes will be attributed to her.

Like her or loathe her - things will have to change

One thing is for sure, whatever anyone thinks about her is that she is getting an awful lot of attention and coverage. Can't help but heighten awareness of the subject

I for one, really don't appreciate the vitriol that the current protestations, mainly from teens/early 20's that my generation destroyed the environment
Our milk came in glass bottles, rinsed and returned, not throwaway plastic bottles.
We returned our glass bottles , especially lemonade, and all our soft drinks, Coca-Cola etc came in glass bottles, not throwaway plastic.
Our sweets came in paper bags, as did a lot of our groceries.
Our fish and chips came wrapped in newspaper, not throwaway polyestyrene containers. Pizza and burger boxes weren't an issue, we didn't have them.
We walked to school and back...in all weathers, not in Mummy's 4x4.

So maybe they should think of who is having the greatest impact on the environment. Perhaps starting with helping to clear the mountain of plastic waste they leave after their rally's, and protest marches.

Hypocrites.

but did we not grow up and start to drive the 4x4, use plastic bottles to excess and order our pizzas and burgers in a polystyrene box :)
The children of yesterday are todays adults.

macafee2

I can remember sustainably recycling glass jam jars in 1948. Yes, as children we climbed over the Rag 'n Bone man's wall (Old Swan, Liverpool, don't suppose it's there now) to rescue a bag-full from his salvage pile then go in the front for the penny back on each of them. Sustainably? Oh yes. You could do it over and over again.

OH yes! Far from Liverpool though, possibly Lytham?

Many find Greta's performance cringe worthy. She is obviously a troubled young person. She should receive help, not dish out panic to easily influenced other youngsters.
What has the world come to, if immature insecure and troubled youths start setting the agenda? Total madness.
She is a front of the climate change crowd, which again is driven by some of the richest people on this earth. They are rich, and the tend to stay that way, by imposing taxes and regulations benefiting their interests at our expense.
It is easy to preach to the peasants from the comfort of your tax deductible air conditioned private jet. It is easy to pay and sway politicians to introduce laws that will serve their purpose, especially if you can panic their voters into agreement.
Nobody wondered how she got so much exposure in the media? Up for a Nobel prize? You must be joking.!
She is right, she should be in school.
This hysteria started with "global cooling" when indeed temperatures dropped, then we got higher temperatures and they switched to "global warming" and now, just to be on the safe side, it is "climate change", covering all eventualities. And yet climate always has, and always will, change. Everything moves in cycles.
Do humans affect the climate? Well, let's put it this way, the total human consumption of energy per year! equals the total influx of energy from the sun in one hour!
Climate change is becoming a new religion, with everything that implies in terms of group pressure, blind faith, repression and lack of science.
The Spanish Inquisition could become an apt analogy.

And yet there are so many pressing issues that could do with our attention.

Greta is an exponent of Swedish society in general, which seems fully intent on committing collective suicide. A remarkable achievement for a country that was once vikings.

In years to come, we might well start measuring insanity in Thunbergs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8455KEDitpU

Given that 32% of the world's population has been born this century (yes, from 2000), I hardly think the young have the right to lecture we oldies!

And that is what it was A PERFORMANCE :shrug:

As to how the Swedes see the situation:
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/1...es-are-fleeing



Unbelievable, but the ruling elite is running things just for themselves.
There is no justice, just "Just us!" as per Gerald Celente.:cool:

Unbelievable, but the ruling elite is running things just for themselves.
There is no justice, just "Just us!" as per Gerald Celente.


Always been the same...:shrug:

I can't help noticing that their cause has now been conflated, or at least loosely associated, with a 'new age' diagnosis of a behavioural abnormality.

I think it might just have the reverse effect for both messages to suffer - both the environment and the condition. That, just in my view, is an unnecessary and unhelpful twist. In fact, a cynical twist. "The Environment" has become a hive of wannabees (sic) drawn from all quarters - some not so altruistic or desirable.

The Swedish situation is a "it seemed like a good idea at the time, guvnor" idea, or even"what could possibly go wrong" at work. Mind you our time is coming fast. Chris.S.

Maybe I'm missing something. The article quoted seems to be about the supposed beginnings of a society to descend to a level of crime that long-term native residents are fleeing from. How does that apply to Greta Thunberg? Immigration and gangs are not related to climate.

If the establishment is running the country for its own benefit why would they want to inflict terrible crime causing population dispersal? Seems counter-productive. A settled population of several generations would be most beneficial and produce the desired growth and production surely?

And these guys want to tell us how to live our lives?:D

https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1...759872/video/1

Wow. That quote of Watson sounds like a modification of something attributed to Goebbels.
'If you repeat a lie enough it becomes the truth' or words to that effect.
The main driver of climate change is the Sun. The sheer ignorance of anyone who states 'we've had the warmest winter since records began. Therefore we have global warming' is depressing. There have been over forty scare narratives by the media in the last fifty years. Global cooling to global warming to climate change. Peak oil, peak population, mass starvation, various doombug scenarios, yah de yah. Michael Moore made a fortune out of scary predictions which all proved false.
We'd need 4.5 billion years of climate records to make reasonable predictions and these false prophets of doom are asking us to believe their less than 200 years of climate change records gives an accurate answer. They then confuse correlation with causality and extrapolate in a completely unscientific way. Follow the money which buys their 'research'
We've had ice ages lasting 100,000 years. We've had desert temperatures in Northern Europe, all long before industrialisation.
I'd give my full support however to the need to look at reducing pollution and toxic waste and moving in an increasingly sustainable direction. Manipulating children to deliver a distorted message is counterproductive.

Bring back 5 star leaded petrol, then we can run higher boost pressures and more ignition advance and with the extra power we can get to our destination faster and save the planet that way. Simples.

We are up against people who have no idea what is going on. Unfortunately the majority of people does not necessarily constitute people with common sense.
This is clearly evident here:
https://twitter.com/RealSaavedra/sta...289664/video/1

What is really going on? Lobotomized zombies?

I cannot help but think that young woman wanting to eat the babies was some kind of candid camera type show inspired by Sacha Baren Cohen with his Ali G and Borat characters. Not a vegetarian in sight to say 'meat is murder' though.

I wasn't aware when I posted earlier that Greta was born with an adversity. :eek: I'm not really knowledgeable about it but if it is similar to others in effect then maybe not a lot that those close to her can do at times other than to cling on to the reins when required and try to guide her. It explains a lot to me and attracts my respect and understanding. :bowdown:

That’s the point WillyH. Greta is now the public voice of an organisation that is founded and funded by extremely wealthy organised people seeking to further their particular interests (one.org is of the USA Kennedy clan together with various entertainment individuals).

Nobody would even think to question her sincerity and passion nor would anyone fail to help and support her, hence my guarded remarks earlier. I’m neither medically trained nor forensically aware of the range of her symptoms but I am aware of the motivational instincts of her non-familial handlers.

Your respect and support for Greta, amongst so many millions of people, is endorsed by me as stated in my first post on here. Unfortunately, that humanity is well recognised by the corporate bodies using (that word intended to be in the gentle sense) the principle of association to bring respectability and a considerable degree of acceptance and therefore belief, from a world-wide audience.

If that is what is happening, and who can say one way or the other, then Greta is being abused and her condition exacerbated. Strong, yes I know, and the lobby is too. Maybe they are blinded by their crusade, maybe not.

She is a crank, and if nobody else want to say it, I don't mind doing it.
Female and young, everybody makes excuses for her behaviour, but nobody in their right mind would let her drive the bus!
Then why let her set the agenda for international politics?
People have gone bunkers.

1.She is a crank, and if nobody else want to say it, I don't mind doing it.

2.Female and young, everybody makes excuses for her behaviour, but nobody in their right mind would let her drive the bus!

3.Then why let her set the agenda for international politics?

To: xx(according to your profile).

1. Unless you are a doctor and have examined her, and have knowledge and experience of autism, that’s a remarkably strong position to take!

2. A generally accepted opinion (from before her association with one.org) from reputable sources suggests she is autistic and not everybody is making excuses for her. In fact I don’t think anyone would say her condition is an ‘excuse’. I expect she would be denied any kind of driving licence.

3. She isn’t. Her involvement (presumably innocent) association with one.org is entirely re-setting the agenda (their words and stated aims) and paying vast fortunes to do it. She is being used, even if her loving parents do agree with that.
It has nothing to do with politics (small p) and everything to do with commercial gain from altered commercial objectives.

Alright maybe she is not a crank? just a pain in the arsk. and exploited and whatever and as previous. Reasoned argument and debate does not work, it was tried with a couple of 19th20th century men and millions died. Chris S.

Only slightly off-topic but relevant to the underlying cause.

Just received my EPC (Energy Performance Certificate) now necessary if you want to sell your house (found a death-nest that suits). The cost of doing the work to achieve maximum efficiency to satisfy recommended targets would be £30,000. The energy saved by doing this would be £899 over three years. So it would take 33 years to break even. Where do I sign?

Just reward for letting the inmates run the asylum.
I don't think a lot of people realize what you are in for!

You will get skinned alive.:getmecoat:

Has the Feed in Tariff been discontinued since (I assume existing members of the scheme still receive it). I was kind of interested when it did exist. Since then I have been bombarded with facebook adverts extolling the virtue of solar panels now the tariff has ended. Not sure where to go now as I think the adverts contain a lot of "hot air"

That was a 'no contest' exhibition. Completely destroyed her. Put me in mind of that northern lad who could drop a gasometer on to a handkerchief in a gale.

Somebody said on Question Time their thoughts were worthy but the methods were destroying the message and creating the opposite of what they wanted. I would take a bet her name was hot on the heels of too much Scrabble & Absinth in a camp somewhere in the forest. Hadn't even had a wash.

Apparently Sound Bites are the new nuggets of misinformation.

I thought that was quite good!

I saw the interview and she didn't have a clue ! She advocates a ban on flying and the confiscation of all fossil fuelled vehicles !

I'm really starting to worry that these anarchists are being allowed to get their own way and someone is going to get killed by one of these fanatics :mad:

Not just anarchists it would seem! The IMF have weighed in and It's a good job our national grid isn't coal heavy for generating electricity as the IMF want the Paris accord countries to increase the carbon tax from $2/ton to $75/ton, raising household electric bills 43% if the grid is powered by coal & raise petrol prices 14% etc :eek: https://blogs.imf.org/2019/10/10/fis...limate-change/


https://media1.tenor.com/images/fe4b...temid=10730215

Watched this and oh man how the heck do these people actually get air time? The ignorance and denial of people like her and them getting air time to put their poorly studied ideas out there is dangerous

Yes I can see ructions happening here, I've been reading that Birmingham city council are voting on a WPL (workplace parking levy) like Scotland voted for the other day on Tuesday 15th Oct to implement a £500/parking space :eek: to get people out of cars & onto public transport.

https://airqualitynews.com/2019/10/1...-parking-levy/

Demonstrations are being held here because we are supine and allow rebellious fanatics with destructive aims a free go at paralysing the roads and everything around them.

The organisers are actually paying activists to do their worst, more than £200,000 since the start of the scheme. Try that in China!

China’s coal-derived power is currently 10 times that of UK. They are now planning a rise in coal fired power stations that exceeds our total energy capacity by a factor of three.

ExReb only demonstrate here because they would be shot in China. We are fools to allow it. Those red-robed figures doing their conscientious objector bit? Direct from drama school and making material to impress and improve grades. Students on grants! Not an original thought between them.

So people are waking up, are they?! :D
They first tell you what you can say and what you can't, and then it is downhill from there, if you let them.!
And as for anarchists - most people don't know what it means, I suggest you look it up!
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...PgMptmTp9gUUQ3

Not quite sure who you (by 'you') mean Kaiser.

The situation is far more involved than most people realize.
Give Harley Schlanger an hour of your time, he might just surprise you:
https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/bus...all/e/64339539

I know people mean well discussing Climate Change, and I am well aware it needs to be addressed, but why is being shoved down our throats on here? :duh:

Rev.

The only way you can get confronted by anything written here, is if you click on this thread.
I suggest you refrain from doing so, if it upsets you.

And here is an article how the adoption of EV will reduce state revenue, and how, to compensate, you will pay with personal freedom.

https://oilprice.com/Alternative-Ene...-Adoption.html

Kaiser, or xx if you prefer, I'm sure I'm missing something. In posts 72 & 79 you mention 'you' but, at least for me, the object is unclear. May I ask you again who your intended audience is ie: an individual or a wider aspect. I wouldn't want to misunderstand your meaning. Thanks.

It's now got the Royal seal of approval in the environmental bill this morning. :eek: https://airqualitynews.com/2019/10/1...ion-confirmed/

I don't share your concern. The meaning does not change whichever way you interpret the word "you".
And as I am all for free expression and free choice, I will leave it to you how you want to define "you".:D

Driving a car requires an infrastructure like roads and bridges etc. Established tax practice used to be that if you wanted to use these roads, you, as a road user, would have to pay for construction and maintenance. I think that principle is well established and regarded as fair, if fairly implemented

I would be unhappy if I, as a cyclist, would have to subsidize you as an electric vehicle user, for using the infrastructure.
No doubt any government would be forced to consider the users of EVs to pay their fair share of such infrastructure. Currently that is done via a tax on the fuel you use. So if you don't drive, you pay nothing, if you drive, you pay proportionally to the amount you use of fuel.

Now, how would that be done for electric vehicles?

You pay a Vehicle Excise Tax(VEL) to use a vehicle on a road, its been done before, say £300.00 per 4wheeled, and £100.00 increase for another 2wheels. Pollution tax paid by maker on each vehicle at 10% of Retail sale price. No "special cases" Chris.S.

Simple. Every charging point, even domestic outlets, to contain a mini dedicated meter, they are very simple. Commercial establishments to charge before plug release or have credit card inserted prior to charging. Domestic charge points have separate tariffs which are added to usual domestic direct debit bills. These can be changed remotely to reflect duties payable as in smart meters so tax imperatives can be maintained. However, if total charges are equivalent to liquid fuel usage there is no cost advantage so will affect roll-out. Cost will always be a factor. There will be glitches, but there is minimal hardware, no outer premises or staff overheads and instant disconnection where required. Provider revenue (and their corp. tax) is liable.

How are you going to differentiate between domestic use of electricity and the charging of an EV?.

A bicycle uses the infra structure created for cars, and the wear and tear is probably not measurable.
If you look up the cost of creating one mile of road, you are looking in the millions, but you can go and do that exercise.
YOU might not agree that the car owners have to pay for that, but I can assure you non car owners will not pay for your privilege of driving your car!
As for the wear and tear on the roads, a bicycle will be absolutely non consequential for a road. A 10 ton truck most certainly would not.

A fixed high insurance premium is not going to work. Why would you as, say, a pensioner pay a high insurance for your EV if it spends most of it's time in the garage?. If you have a petrol driven car, it would costs you far less, if you don't drive. I would choose the petrol version in that case. Wouldn't you?

What we are coming back to is this.
How are you going to get people to pay proportionally for using the road in EVs!

The fact is the road structure has to be maintained and increased. How are you going to finance that? if you can't tax EVs for their use of roads.

I suggest you re-read the post you quote. I am confident your question need not have been posed.

Have I missed something here? EV must pay to charge up and sure the Government will have a proportion of that as a tax(duty) The charging points are at "filling(charging stations)" money or debit Card payment. No way have domestic charging, we don't fill cars up at home for safety reasons and same for EV. Of course you must pay towards the road infrastructure. No special cases. EV's surely are as polluting as other vehicles, plenty of man made materials in them for starters. Chris.S.

'Filling' the car with electric charge, empty to full, is not possible in the same time span as with liquid fuel.

The period of non-use is usually overnight to ensure a full charge for the following day so lengthy charging periods on standard mains will apply. Makes sense to use that period because the demand, and therefore the load, on the national grid is vastly reduced.

With the advent of smart meters, and it's easy to believe this was one of the reasons for the heavy advertising of the meters, it is easy to have different rates of duty applied remotely.

As mentioned earlier the charge could draw standard 240v mains current with a dedicated mini-meter in the socket so the amount of current drawn for that purpose could only be for the vehicle concerned and no other appliance.

Therefore the overall bill could be adjusted on a domestic account rebate basis. With successive budgets changing the tax levy it would be a simple way of maintaining tax receipts on vehicles. The State would finally have total control of population mobility! Dystopian or what.

Thanks for that Ray, just about confirms my theory that Electric cars will a bit restricted as far as customers. Middle classes, Govt. Officials and the rich. Chris.S.

:xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007::xmas-smiley-007:

https://media1.tenor.com/images/a5c0...temid=14052589


For using Christmas smilies in October. :D:p:

8 'Activists' were arrested. I bet no charges will be made.

Barbed wire area needed in Hyde Park, all activists can protest inside as long as they want, however, no key available to let them out and rain shelters not to be provided.

Alternatively, follow the example of other countries, read the Riot Act, invoke "aid to the civil power" and bring in the military.

They have a right to peaceful protest but we have the right to pass and repass on the Queen's highway.

It's a protest by proxy. So a lie. The only people affected by the 'protest' are the general public - the people who have the power to do something about it are protected from the civil disturbance.

It's about time a protest that causes mass potentially violent disruption and cancelled public transport is considered just as much a hate crime as, say, one baker politely declining to bake one cake with a slogan on it. Tolerance is one thing but we have become a laughing stock because of a miniscule tiny minority.

I see Brum has backed the parking levy to reduce congestion & pollution. https://www.transport-network.co.uk/...ngestion/16227

(My own post so ok to clip for relevant para.)

Read today i page 5 US scientists have discovered how to charge an electric car battery in 10 minutes to 80% and multiple charges are possible without deterioration. So my sentence above should be viewed with caution!